16 replies to this topic

[Austin55]

Pretty huge plot of land (around 19-20 acres) near Topgolf is on next week's Zoning Agenda.

 

 

 

Case: ZC-22-114

Date: September 14, 2022 @ 1:00 PM

Site Location: 2212 E. 4th St.

Request:  "PD 310" Planned Development for “MU-1” uses, multifamily and retail,  to remove density requirements but maintain the maximum amount of Multifamily units allowed in the current PD.

 

This project would join The Grayson, which is a 336-unit project located across the street to the north of here. 

 

 

[JBB]

Interesting.  Lots of gas well paraphernalia on the east half of the property including a compressor station.  The Blackmon Mooring warehouse this property surrounds is owned by an investor.

[steave]

So is the gas well all used up or do they sink a new hole somewhere else? I've always wondered that about these well sites around the city and whether or not with directional drilling they could relocate the equipment on the site elsewhere. There are many of them in otherwise good locations for literally any other kind of development. Like the one between Bryant Irvin and Westridge south of the Ridglea retirement home, or the other one on the same road a mile south at the intersection of Arborlawn.

[Austin55]

The zoning docket makes this sound very interesting, and huge. There's a lot of legalese and some zoning technical talk in the docket but here's the gist:

 

Proposed Use: Multi Family

 

Request: From: “PD 310R” Planned Development/Specific Use for multi-family and commercial subject to 37 acres of multi-family residential at a density of 30 to 36 units per acre, 7 acres of multi-family residential at a density of 30 to 50 units per acre, 12.5 acres of retail restaurant and commercial.

To: Amend “PD 310” to remove the multifamily density per acre restriction to allow 44 acres with a maximum unit count of 1,682 and 12.5 acres of retail, restaurant and commercial.

 

 

Note that the Grayson project across the street is part of the total,  it "accounts for 336 units, allowing for 1,346 units to be developed over the remainder of the PD" per the docket. So this development will 'only' have 1,300+ units, which is an absolutely huge number. 

[AndyN]

So is the gas well all used up or do they sink a new hole somewhere else? I've always wondered that about these well sites around the city and whether or not with directional drilling they could relocate the equipment on the site elsewhere. There are many of them in otherwise good locations for literally any other kind of development. Like the one between Bryant Irvin and Westridge south of the Ridglea retirement home, or the other one on the same road a mile south at the intersection of Arborlawn.

 

There are 3 drilling pads between I35W and the Trinity River and between 121 and the TRE tracks. The pads serve multiple lease units include the Tindall Lease, the Little Lease, the Little Mipa Lease, The Little PVI Lease, The Mipa PVI Lease, The TRWD Bend Lease, The Big Bend Lease, the Fourth Street "A" Gas Unit, the AHF Lease and the Fourth Street Model Lease (not sure if the latter will ever be drilled).

 

On the 3 pads there are 24 permitted wells, of which 15 have been drilled. As of the most recent Production Data (April 2022) varies from as low as 0 MCF (thousand cubic feet) to as much as 65,834 MCF. In theory, assuming no other restrictions or expirations apply to the remaining 9 permitted wells could still be drilled.

 

The wells are normally spaced 15 feet apart in columns with rows 35 feet apart. The drilling rigs in use are known as "walking rigs" and can move from one spud hole to the next without having to disassemble and reassemble the rig.

 

In my southeast Fort Worth neighborhood, there is currently an active drilling rig near the intersection of Southeast Loop 820 and I-20. Natural gas prices have gone up enough that drilling new wells is once again profitable.

 

I have a partial interest in a gas well unit off Northside Drive. The completed well is still producing but the volume has been variable over the last few years (5,793 MCF Jan 2022-10,241 MCF Jun 2022) and much less than the initial production (79,072 MCF October 2011). I wouldn't mind seeing the other 3 permitted wells completed.

 

Unless the leases have expired or the land developer has paid to cancel the leases, I don't know if they can do anything within the drilling envelope that would adversely affect the ability to drill new wells on the pads.

[Urbndwlr]

Andy, help me (us) understand implications of the part where you wrote above, "I don't know if they can do anything within the drilling envelope that would adversely affect the ability to drill new wells on the pads."

 

What constitutes the "drilling envelope"?

Any idea how closely can one realistically build to the property that is the drilling area/envelope (whatever term applies)?

 

I assume that there are ordinances that prevent building any occupiable space within x feet of potential drill/well/equipment locations just in case of bad stuff happening (blowing up/catching fire, etc).  Then also I assume there are access easements if not a road from the drilling/well/equipment to the streets.

[AndyN]

After I posted, I found a copy of the proposed plat for one of the projects. The "envelopes" are shown and it looks like they put the parking, dog park and dumpsters in the no-building area and shifted the occupied buildings to the southwest, away from the drill pads.

 

Most of my experience in oil & gas surveying is in the Delaware Basin in west Texas where we never had an issue with being close to an occupied building.

[Austin55]

The hearing for this case was delayed 30 days due to a "notification issue"

[johnfwd]

Aside from the natural gas well obstacle to further development, what concerns me most is the use of land to the northeast of downtown around Topgolf for more mixed-use projects--multi-family residential and commercial development.  I consider this area, and the area north of the Trinity River, to be a future expansion of downtown.  I'd hate to see it populated with a "sprawl" of low-rise apartment complexes like The Grayson.  We have enough of these existing on the fringes of downtown. 

 

Eventually, there will be a scarcity of land available downtown for office tower construction.  It's no wonder big corporations wanting to relocate to Fort Worth are likely to build horizontally designed corporate campuses in outlying areas such as Alliance Texas.

[JBB]

It would likely be decades before land is scarce enough for high rise development to spread that direction.  Low rise apartments will be easy to tear down if the land is more valuable for vertical construction.

[Stadtplan]

Aside from the natural gas well obstacle to further development, what concerns me most is the use of land to the northeast of downtown around Topgolf for more mixed-use projects--multi-family residential and commercial development.  I consider this area, and the area north of the Trinity River, to be a future expansion of downtown.  I'd hate to see it populated with a "sprawl" of low-rise apartment complexes like The Grayson.  We have enough of these existing on the fringes of downtown. 

 

Eventually, there will be a scarcity of land available downtown for office tower construction.  It's no wonder big corporations wanting to relocate to Fort Worth are likely to build horizontally designed corporate campuses in outlying areas such as Alliance Texas.

 

johnfwd, I see your point and am not a fan of some of these land uses either, but I don't know....it seems like it would be generations beyond our lifetime before that is a concern not excluding tearing down some of these new-to-us, stick-framed apartments 30-years from now.  Everything is for sale for the right price.  If you're following some of the development in Dallas in the Field St district north of Woodall Rogers, "The complex of towers would replace the North End Apartments, which were built in 1997. The new buildings would surround a 1.5-acre central park."   The same argument could have been made with regards to several other (missed) opportunities closer in to downtown:

• Radio Shack headquarters: a mid-rise suburban looking corporate campus that replaced housing projects
• TCC Trinity River Campus East: another mid-rise campus right in downtown
• Hillside "Apartments" which look more like duplex houses that replaced housing projects right next to downtown
• What about Butler Place, could they build hi-rise affordable housing there?
• All of the surface lots east of Calhoun seem like opportunities to expand downtown.
• What about some of the low and mid-rise buildings west of Henderson?

[Jeriat]

 

Aside from the natural gas well obstacle to further development, what concerns me most is the use of land to the northeast of downtown around Topgolf for more mixed-use projects--multi-family residential and commercial development.  I consider this area, and the area north of the Trinity River, to be a future expansion of downtown.  I'd hate to see it populated with a "sprawl" of low-rise apartment complexes like The Grayson.  We have enough of these existing on the fringes of downtown. 

 

Eventually, there will be a scarcity of land available downtown for office tower construction.  It's no wonder big corporations wanting to relocate to Fort Worth are likely to build horizontally designed corporate campuses in outlying areas such as Alliance Texas.

 

johnfwd, I see your point and am not a fan of some of these land uses either, but I don't know....it seems like it would be generations beyond our lifetime before that is a concern not excluding tearing down some of these new-to-us, stick-framed apartments 30-years from now.  Everything is for sale for the right price.  If you're following some of the development in Dallas in the Field St district north of Woodall Rogers, "The complex of towers would replace the North End Apartments, which were built in 1997. The new buildings would surround a 1.5-acre central park."   The same argument could have been made with regards to several other (missed) opportunities closer in to downtown:

• Radio Shack headquarters: a mid-rise suburban looking corporate campus that replaced housing projects
• TCC Trinity River Campus East: another mid-rise campus right in downtown
• Hillside "Apartments" which look more like duplex houses that replaced housing projects right next to downtown
• What about Butler Place, could they build hi-rise affordable housing there?
• All of the surface lots east of Calhoun seem like opportunities to expand downtown.
• What about some of the low and mid-rise buildings west of Henderson?

 

 

Every time I see this, I think: 

"Eventually" . . . 

 

And when was Firestone built? Just two years after North End in Uptown. 
 

[Stadtplan]

All things are possible. 

 

From another DMN article yesterday....

"The North End Apartments, just a block north of downtown Dallas on Field Street, are being demolished for the new Goldman Sachs campus.(Northend Apartments)"

[Austin55]

Hillside was definitely not meant to be around for a long time, Ill be surprised if its still there in 20 years.

[Urbndwlr]

Yes, IMO best to think about these as evolutionary changes.  Doesn't excuse bad design as 30-40 years is still a long time. 

 

Firestone and the Henderson apartments both were completed circa 1999/2000.  They were first of the new, ground up institutional multifamily development in Downtown.  7th Street Station was built right around the same time.  Notice both Firestone and 7th Street Station were mostly surface parked.  Not sure if was because of zoning density limitations at the time or because of economic feasibility at the time.  Rents in those were about $0.95-0.97/SF range when they opened (from memory).   I dont know if MU Downtown H zoning had gone into place yet.  C or D (MF) zoning were (and still are) really low density.

 

I remember hearing/reading that at least one City Councilmember was concerned about the density - think was Chuck Silcox in particular.  Don't know if it was the appearance (3 vs 4 stories) or concerns over car traffic generated.

 

I also recall hearing that the Firestone's design was influenced by DFWI to basically redesign/urbanize a conventional garden apartment complex into one people now call "gurban" - meaning the they take typical 3-story walk-up garden apartment buildings and push the buildings out to the sidewalk with parking concealed in the middle of the block.  Definitely a better outcome than if had been suburban-style garden apartments. 

 

Funny to reflect back on that by 20-25 years. 

 

I believe Firestone has 350 units on a total of 11 acres = 31-32 units/acre. 

Today, that low density would be unthinkable on that site for economic feasibility reasons.  And I'd assume zero City Council pushback for higher density residential housing in our city's core.

[Austin55]

The zoning change was passed unanimously. No further information was given. 

[Austin55]

The warehouse in the middle of this property has been listed for sale: https://www.loopnet....tent=&utm_term=