41 replies to this topic

[johnfwd]

Walking through Burnett Park on a beautiful sunny January afternoon I looked around and wondered, to myself, what was missing?  What would add to the wonderful environs of this park?  Anyone care to fill in the blanks?

 

I have my own suggestion but would like to hear others'.

[Austin55]

Here's an idea I posted sometime back, http://www.fortworth...=+burnett +park

[Big Frog II]

Maybe a Central Fountain.

[John T Roberts]

The current version had fountains, but they were removed.  The earlier version that was completely removed in the early 1980s had an off center fountain and fish pond.  This water feature was not organic in nature, but carefully designed.  That earlier version was very formal and baroque in its styling.

[johnfwd]

A central fountain was my thought, too!  It's too bad this aesthetic feature was removed from the park.

 

Austin, I'm sorry but I didn't see your 2016 thread--once again the search program failed me.

[roverone]

How the 500 W 7th revitalization goes might help restore this park to its former importance for a broader population of downtown by pulling people that direction.

 

But in general, if you want people to sit around and make your park feel alive, put food in their hands -- street vendors or food trucks would be a draw at least for weekday lunch, and it is something that our other more recent square has been very reluctant to do (maybe that will change).

[Volare]

A wrecking ball for that monstrosity to the west.

[renamerusk]

A wrecking ball for that monstrosity to the west.

Shame on you; it is not as monstrous as you think. 

[txbornviking]

I think the park could greatly be activated by more folks actually living nearby

[johnfwd]

I think the park could greatly be activated by more folks actually living nearby

 

This will soon change when Burnett Lofts apartments are constructed in that expansive tract between Texas Street and Lancaster Avenue.

[Austin55]

Burnett Lofts is a great start. There's several empty or nearly empty plots of land right there that could really go a long way towards enhancing the area if they were developed too.

 

I've also long thought that converting the lower floor of the the garage to the East side of the park would go a long way too. Maybe even a cafe in Burnett Plaza's first floor with some patio seating in the park.

[rriojas71]

Burnett Lofts is a great start. There's several empty or nearly empty plots of land right there that could really go a long way towards enhancing the area if they were developed too.
 
I've also long thought that converting the lower floor of the the garage to the East side of the park would go a long way too. Maybe even a cafe in Burnett Plaza's first floor with some patio seating in the park.

Austin, you and I are on the same page. I have had the same thoughts about the Parking Garage across the street.

[Austin55]

I believe John has mentioned that it was designed with future conversion as a possibility. 

[John T Roberts]

Yes, I had mentioned that earlier.  Most of the garages in Downtown were designed for conversion to ground floor retail. 

[rriojas71]

I know people may find this peculiar but I think some of the trees need to be removed... Not a ton, but I think they almost obscure the park from the street and when you are driving by it doesn't necessarily look like a public space.  Little things like that can be deceiving on how they affect visibility.  I do think there should be some central water feature... maybe like an ornate fountain in ode to the old Burnett Park.  Water always makes public spaces more enticing.

[JBB]

I would remove some trees along the perimeter to make it more open from the streets, remove some of the criss cross sidewalks to create a more continuous lawn in the center, allow food trucks on the surrounding streets or put in a fast-casual restaurant on the 7th Street side.  The park has some good bones.  I think some tweaks could make it similar to Bryant Park in NYC.

[renamerusk]

No tree removal.  It is very possible with effort to work every tree into a redesign open space.

[John T Roberts]

JBB, do you think you could remove all of the criss cross sidewalks in the middle of the park and have a green space that would be very similar to Bryant Park?  It seems that would be something that could work.  Then the pedestrian pathways would be around the perimeter at the existing paved and walkway areas.  I measured Bryant Park as roughly 500' x 500' from the thru-block walkway on the west side of the NY Public Library to 6th Ave., and from 40th to 42nd Street.  Burnett Park is about 433' from Burnett Plaza to Lamar St. and about 333' from 7th to 10th Streets.  From these measurements, you can see that Burnett Park is smaller.

[renamerusk]

I would like to see a paved plaza more like Sundance Square so that walking is free formed.  Encircle existing trees with seating and definitely put in a large water fountain where birds could bath. 

 

Every tree is precious now; and these matured trees will be almost impossible to replace if they are removed.

 

In Mexico, we stayed at a boutique hotel with a paved plaza at its door.  There was free public wifi and the locals sat around, grouped danced and brought food to eat in the plaza from the nearby eateries.  There was a statue honoring the armed forces as the centerpiece of the plaza.  I would estimate the whole plaza to be about the size of Burnett Park.  I think hot sandwiches, pastries,etc that can be purchase from shops in the retail level of the garage would be all that was needed to make Burnett Park a go to place.

[Doohickie]

When considering changes to the park, bear in mind that Lamar will have significantly more traffic once it connects with Hemphill.  And will it also become a two-way street?  I could see pressure to widening the street north of the tunnel.

[Austin55]

 And will it also become a two-way street?  I could see pressure to widening the street north of the tunnel.

 

It's being made two-way right now. I don't know how they'd widen it though, unless you mean removing the parking lane.

[Austin55]

I think there's also got to be some potential to create a synergy with the mini-park to the North and the Plaza at First on 7th. I'd close or narrow to a single lane Burnett Street between 6th and 7th, as it doesn't go anywhere as is. You could then activate that area somehow, perhaps again another fountain or sculpture or whatever "weenie". You could also expand it out towards the street some, look at all the paint on the road here you can't drive on. Why not bump the curbs out into that space and put some grass and sidewalks on it and make the park a little larger? 

The developers of First on 7th are already proposing some changes to the plaza so it could be nice changes. 

 

As for Burnett Park itself, I'd agree with other posters that the trees should be kept and also would'nt mind getting rid of the criss crossing paths in the middle, a grassy space would be better IMO. 

 

Edit - It looks like the First on 7th developers are already on this. In this slide, they appear to propose a cafe on the little triangle park and enhanced connections between the building and triangle.

[renamerusk]

When considering changes to the park, bear in mind that Lamar will have significantly more traffic once it connects with Hemphill.  And will it also become a two-way street?  I could see pressure to widening the street north of the tunnel.

 

 

It's being made two-way right now. I don't know how they'd widen it though, unless you mean removing the parking lane.

 

 Here we go again!

 

 Create more automobile infrastructure, a tunnel that did not exist, and then say because it will generate more traffic, there is now a need to widen streets.  It circular madness on the part of City Traffic Engineering.

 

The simple solution is to funnel northbound traffic to Taylor Street. It makes no sense at all that a traffic flow solution was not included in the Lamar Tunnel Project.

[Doohickie]

 

 And will it also become a two-way street?  I could see pressure to widening the street north of the tunnel.

 

It's being made two-way right now. I don't know how they'd widen it though, unless you mean removing the parking lane.

 

 

That's pretty much exactly what I was thinking.

[renamerusk]

I'm liking the idea of closing Burnett Street and eliminating all the twists and turns to accommodate the automobile.  Instead of widening streets Downtown, how about widening the sidewalks, adding more landscape; in other words "road diets".

[Austin55]

Hemphill is going to be only one lane only, I bet Taylor will be fine. 

[renamerusk]

Hemphill,  one lane?

[Doohickie]

Hemphill is going to be only one lane only, I bet Taylor will be fine. 

 

 

Hemphill,  one lane?

 

It may start as one lane, but when you look at what's being built, the tunnel right-of-way is as wide as the 4-lane (2 each way) section of Hemphill south of Vickery.  North of Lancaster Lamar (not Taylor) necks down to one lane each direction, but even that ROW looks like it could handle 4 lanes of traffic with no parking or turn lanes.  I doubt the city would do it without expanding the width between the curbs but like I think there will be pressure to do so by nibbling away at sidewalks, etc., between Lancaster and W7th.

EDIT:  With the Hemphill road diet south of Vickery though, maybe that pressure won't be as pronounced; that wider ROW might be used for bike lanes.

[renamerusk]

So what I think is the solution without street disruption is the solution that exists where Spur 280 egresses and ingresses into Downtown.  Ingress is funneled to 4th and 6th and egress is funnel from 5th and 7th. 

 

https://www.google.c...-97.3292555,17z

 

Now, if you funnel the expected increase of traffic that egresses Downtown through Lamar Tunnel to a one-way Taylor, then you don't need to widen Lamar Street.  You have an existing solution that has been proven already to work.  One thing that has been curious to me is the justification for building the tunnel in the first instance.

[JBB]

Probably best fit for another topic, but I've always thought the tunnel was someone's pet project that was seen as important to connecting downtown and the south side prior to redevelopment and revival on Main taking off.  

[renamerusk]

Well JBB, I suspect that there is much into what you are thinking.

[Doohickie]

I feel the same.  There are crossings at Summit/8th, Henderson, Jennings, Commerce/Main.  The Jennings crossing is one block east of this one (and has a pretty good transition between Jennings and Hemphill).  I ride the Main and Jennings tunnel regularly, and even the Henderson underpass occasionally, on my bicycle, and there is rarely much traffic on any of those crossings.  So I really don't see why this tunnel is needed, unless they plan to add rail/streetcar between Downtown and the Near Southside.

[JBB]

Yeah, rail/streetcar access makes sense, it beats the overpass idea that floated around several years ago, and it hopefully means that the associated proposed east/west railroad trench that would cut off all of the underpasses will never happen.

 

Back to the park, I would amend my tree removal comment to say that I'm advocating thinning out trees along 7th to open it up more, not removing all of them.

 

And just for fun, a photo (not mine) of Bryant Park:

 

[renamerusk]

.......Back to the park, I would amend my tree removal comment to say that I'm advocating thinning out trees along 7th to open it up more, not removing all of them.....

 

 I didn't think you ever advocated for mass tree removal.

 

 Its just that mature trees are priceless; it has taken decades for the Burnett Park Trees to grow to become what they are today.  These trees, in fact all trees, store carbon and reduce carbon's negative impact upon climate.  You can and should consider the benefit of these trees to provide respite from the heat, shelter for birds and contributing to the fresh oxygen that we breathe in every 2-3 seconds.  I have personally added two trees to my landscape at home to compliment my existing trees.

 

All of you are welcome to take as much oxygen as needed.

[rriojas71]

I was not talking about mass tree removal as well... thinning them out a bit like JBB mentioned is what I am talking about.  It probably is a bad idea but they just feel like they obscure the park from the roadway, but maybe that isn't such a bad idea.  I do like removing the crisscrossing sidewalks...  they just seem to discourage the park feel and make it more into a walking plaza...  opening it up and creating more seating will encourage more people to want to spend time there.

[renamerusk]

Its a personal thing for me.  Every time a mature tree is chopped down in the name of progress or to make way for building a 3,000 sf house is painful for me to see. I am surrounded by oaks and pecan trees that could be 60 years old and older.

 

The trees in this park create a mini forest that is something that will take years to replicate.  Besides these trees are probably valued at more than $1,000 each.  I know that any redesign of the park can do what ever it takes to save each tree.

 

A bird's eye view -https://www.google.c...m/data=!3m1!1e3

[Dylan]

How I would improve Burnett Park:

 

- Remove sidewalks in the middle to create a large, continuous lawn.

- Add a fountain, or even a small pond.

- Add a pavilion with a cafe and restrooms.

- Add permanent seating in addition to the portable metal seats that are often put away at night.

- Add more lighting at night.

- Add an adult-sized swing set.

 

Why do swing sets only have to be for kids? Houston's Midtown Park has a high-off-the-ground swing set and it's fun.

 

I'd keep the trees. Perhaps we can build another green park with more open sky somewhere else downtown.

[Volare]

...

Why do swing sets only have to be for kids? Houston's Midtown Park has a high-off-the-ground swing set and it's fun....

 

Because lawyers and insurance companies are involved that's why.

Playgrounds these days are so pathetically safe that you can't get much above head high and 3 mph at any point.

[Doohickie]

They *do* have adult/senior training equipment though.  Maybe they could put some of those up.

 

There are a number of fitness stations in Rosemont Park and I've seen people using them quite a bit.  Basically the idea is you jog around the park, and every time to come to a station you do the exercise it's built for, and by the time you're done, you've supposedly done a well-rounded workout.

[johnfwd]

Trees for shade when the temp is over 100 in Fort Worth.  I think that's what Mr. Burnett had in mind when he penned his thoughts for the sculpture piece fronting Seventh Street.   A fountain and water coolers would go nicely on such hot days.  And I wouldn't sit on a metal chair under a blazing sun, either.  In summertime, do you see anyone sitting on the benches in the treeless plaza just east of the old courthouse?

 

Maybe more grass would be opened up if you get rid of the criss crossing walks.  But I just wonder if these walks were intended to keep people from wearing down the grass to reduce landscape costs.

[RD Milhollin]

What's missing? A Metro subway station.

[elpingüino]

The Burnett Foundation is giving Downtown Fort Worth Inc. a $4.5 million grant as a permanent endowment to maintain Burnett Park.
https://fortworthrep...-downtown-park/