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First Christian Church possible expansion?

Downtown Church First Christian

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#1 Austin55

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 12:42 AM

Found in the FAA request records, 

 

Structure Type: Building Structure Name: Fort Worth- First Christian - NO FREQUENCIE

 

Structure Height:
100

 

 

So, something up to 100 feet. The coordinates are about right on the parking lot to the north. 

 

I've looked in a few other places to see if I could find any other info (past few church newsletters, zoning permits, DDRB records, etc) but didn't find anything. 

 

I suspect First Christian is riding the wave that the next door Frost Tower is bringing to that part of town, and perhaps anticipating the future Sundance hotel on the block to the NE, maybe they are planning an office or residential building rather than an actual expansion of the existing church? A parking garage for church goers perhaps (wouldnt really be a building though)? Not much else to go on here. 

 

Other thing I wonder about is how a large high rise type building might affect the historical integrity and setting of the existing church itself. A large building could be overwhelming, however the block is surrounded on all sides by high rises and skyscrapers already. 



#2 renamerusk

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 09:20 AM

 

Structure Type: Building Structure Name: Fort Worth- First Christian - NO FREQUENCIE..  So, something up to 100 feet. The coordinates are about right on the parking lot to the north. 

 

I've looked in a few other places to see if I could find any other info (past few church newsletters, zoning permits, DDRB records, etc) but didn't find anything..... 

 

I remember that there was talk in the past about the developer group of The Tower having approached FCC about a residential project on that lot. It went quiet for a while; perhaps it is this.



#3 JBB

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 10:02 AM

I was thinking the same thing, but I thought I might have been mixing it up with the 4th-Houston-5th-Throckmorton block.

#4 johnfwd

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 11:37 AM

Perhaps yes to all the above suggestions. But I, too, read one or two of the recent church newsletters (on their website) to see what their capital fund is doing.  Nothing major other than repair and/or upgrade of their air conditioning system.  Now the 3-story church building is roughly 100-ft in height and the AC units are on the roof.  Could possibly a crane be needed for that purpose?



#5 Urbndwlr

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 04:36 PM

Are you sure the First Christian Church owns that parking lot on the north side of their building? 

I recall several years ago Tony Landrum, who redeveloped the Tower, among other projects, proposed a loft residential building there (maybe 5-7 stories?) and the Church fought it. 

 

Some use other than surface parking like a residential or office building would be a great change from the current parking lot.



#6 Austin55

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 05:12 PM

Perhaps yes to all the above suggestions. But I, too, read one or two of the recent church newsletters (on their website) to see what their capital fund is doing.  Nothing major other than repair and/or upgrade of their air conditioning system.  Now the 3-story church building is roughly 100-ft in height and the AC units are on the roof.  Could possibly a crane be needed for that purpose?

 

The listing is for a permant construction of a "building". 

 

Are you sure the First Christian Church owns that parking lot on the north side of their building?

 

No, according to TAD, "TFT partners" owns the building. Not sure who that is though. 



#7 John T Roberts

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 07:22 PM

Austin, I did not know anything was being planned for that vacant lot.  I will ask a friend of mine who is real active at First Christian Church.  You asked about how a large high rise would affect the historical integrity and setting of the church.  Constructing a building that close to the church could affect it structurally while the building is under construction with vibration, noise, excavation, and so forth.  In the eyes of the city regulations, a historic designation stops at the property line, so legally, it doesn't have an affect.  Unless, something unfortunate happens.  Visually, a high rise would change the surroundings.  If you look back on old photographs, there were once buildings on that vacant lot.  One was the old Chamber of Commerce building and the other was the church's education annex.  That education building was seven stories and was taller than the dome of the church. 



#8 JBB

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 09:04 PM

A little Google sleuthing reveals that this property is owned by a company connected to the former owner of the Good Eats Cafe/Grill restaurants that died off in the early '00's.

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#9 John T Roberts

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Posted 03 November 2015 - 09:37 PM

I found out that it is going to be a cellular antenna supposedly installed on the wall of the church.



#10 jsfslls

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 04:59 AM

ummm...wut?



#11 johnfwd

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 06:44 AM

So when you check out an FAA listing having the word "structure," I suppose it's best not to jump to the conclusion that it's going to be a building.  Does anyone know what "NO FREQUENCIE" means?



#12 Austin55

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 08:31 AM

https://oeaaa.faa.go...270170890&row=6

 

Here's a new listing, changed from "Structure" to "Tower". 



#13 JBB

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 09:29 AM

Attaching cellular antennas to existing tall structures is an easy way for churches to generate money. I would assume this will have to go to the DDRB at some point.

#14 renamerusk

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 04:53 PM

Attaching cellular antennas to existing tall structures is an easy way for churches to generate money. I would assume this will have to go to the DDRB at some point.

 

Wow..Read this; it is something to think about -

 

http://www.eastcount...hone_towers_238



#15 JBB

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:00 PM

Something is gonna kill everyone on the planet at some point or another. If you spend your whole life trying to run from what that might be, you'll end up living in a cocoon.

And let's face it, everybody lives near a cell phone tower in this day and age.

#16 renamerusk

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:10 PM

Something is gonna kill everyone on the planet at some point or another. If you spend your whole life trying to run from what that might be, you'll end up living in a cocoon.

And let's face it, everybody lives near a cell phone tower in this day and age.

 

 Is it a fact that everybody lives near a cell phone tower.  I thought that they are generally located along highways and utility corridors; I could be wrong about my assumption.



#17 JBB

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 06:25 PM

Once again, I forgot that what is said on here is taken literally and there's no place for expression or nuance. Sorry.

No, that's not a fact. I'm assuming that many of us live much closer to cell towers than we think. What is a fact is that the vast majority of us (almost everyone) holds the miniature version of a cell tower up to our ear on a regular basis.

#18 renamerusk

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Posted 04 November 2015 - 10:19 PM

Once again, I forgot that what is said on here is taken literally and there's no place for expression or nuance. Sorry.

No, that's not a fact. I'm assuming that many of us live much closer to cell towers than we think. What is a fact is that the vast majority of us (almost everyone) holds the miniature version of a cell tower up to our ear on a regular basis.

 

 I understood your point; but is it acceptable or even practical for a cell tower to be located at this particular location. I would find it to be a better location for the leasing wireless company to place their cellular equipment atop of one of the nearby buildings. Will there possibly be some health hazards faced by residents in The Tower or do we know?



#19 mmmdan

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Posted 05 November 2015 - 08:10 AM

If you get good cell phone reception at your home, then you probably live close to a cell phone tower.  I live close to the middle of Ridglea Hills and the cell phone reception is not the best despite there being antennas all along 183 and Camp Bowie.

 

People also tend to forget that we have been living with tv and radio signals for a long time.  They are much more powerful since they can travel for much longer distances.

 

Don't forget your wi-fi, the computer that sits on your lap that is connected to said wi-fi.  And the bluetooth in your car, or in your wireless headphones, or your fitbit.

 

Can't forget about the police and fire departments.  They've been communicating with radios for a long time too.

 

I'm sure most of us played with walkie-talkies as kids.

 

There's also the entire aviation industry with the millions of aircraft communicating by radio to the ground and other aircraft, and all of the navigation aids.

 

Almost forgot GPS.

 

And then there's the cosmic background radiation https://en.wikipedia...wave_background which a couple of radio astronomers found by accident.  They spent a lot of time figuring out where these "stray" radio waves were coming from before figuring out that the universe is just filled with radio waves.

 

You can look here and see where mobile phones fit into the spectrum https://upload.wikim...io_Spectrum.jpg

 

With the way the mobile spectrum is interspersed with all of the other systems, and a lot of those other systems have been around a lot longer than mobile, I think we would have noticed something by now.



#20 Doohickie

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Posted 05 November 2015 - 10:20 AM

What's the matter with you, bringing science into it?  :smwink:


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#21 renamerusk

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Posted 05 November 2015 - 12:13 PM

With the way the mobile spectrum is interspersed with all of the other systems, and a lot of those other systems have been around a lot longer than mobile, I think we would have noticed something by now.

 

I do find your comments in its entirety to be compelling. 

 

A quick read about cellular towers is revealing in that it shows that they are indeed widespread and have become a growing source of revenue for churches. It would appear that churches are natural sites for cellular installation because their steeples are generally the highest point in a neighborhood. (Think Travis Baptist Church).  That being said, I would think that for this particular location, a better use of the land might have been the residential development that FCC apparently rejected or a commercial use as oppose to a lease of air space for a communication tower.

 

So two questions come to mind:

1 - will the tower be or not be an aesthetic asset?

2 - will the tower eliminate a more profitable use of the site in the future?







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