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Downtown residential..Where is it?


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#1 eastfwther

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 12:47 PM

From what I can tell, the last significant residences built in downtown Fort Worth proper were the condos in the Omni in 2009.  Is there any decent sized residential planned for DTFW??  The Cassidy was promoted as a future highrise condo building for years. But when completed,  we got a six story office building with one floor of apartments.   I was in Austin last week and couldn't believe the amount of housing being built downtown (I've also noticed the large amount of office to residential conversions in downtown Dallas as well as all the new residential construction in Dallas' West End and Farmers Market areas).  What has happened to residential construction in DTFW? It seems to have come to a halt.  Nothing since 2009??  I know downtown  Fort Worth is a nice place to visit, but are people still  interested in living there? Or has the "urban" interest moved to the Southside and W 7th areas?



#2 JBB

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 01:10 PM

Just a quick glance at TAD shows around 20 units in the Omni that still haven't sold. Villa De Leon had the same problem for awhile and Montgomery Plaza still has units that have never sold (at least not past a foreclosure sale). I think the downturn in the real estate market and the glut of vacant high end condos put a damper on things and, although the market is better, the glut hasn't gone away. I'm surprised there hasn't been a demand for rental units in the core of downtown. It may just be that new rental properties on 7th and on Samuels have pulled away some of the demand from downtown. And not to beat a dead horse, but annexation out to the hinterlands toward Denton County, the coming Walsh Ranch development, and the sprawl pipeline that is CTP have done nothing to help the market downtown.

#3 Austin55

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 04:58 PM

Samuels has had a few big "Dallas Doughnuts" go up recently very close to downtown. 

 

-Hunter Plaza's restoration is U/C and will have 164 units. 

-Pinnacle Bank place is supposed to get underway soon, supposed to have 130 units.

-T&P Warehouse is slated to be residential if Cleapatra ever gets around to it. 

-Sundance has said the lots East of the Bass towers will be a "neighborhood" and have townhomes and apartments.

-River Tower II is residential per se but I doubt most of the residents will venture downtown. 

-The Cassidy added like a measly 6 units to Sundance. The fact that it had been proposed at 22 floors or so and downgraded to 6 says a lot about the market I guess.

-The Hilton Annex was recently talked about as being converted to Condos.

 

But you are right, there isn't a lot in the way of new construction. Austin is certainly an anomaly though, anything you compare that place to dulls in comparison to the growth they are having down there. I'm not really sure why Fort Worth'ers don't want to live in downtown. 



#4 John T Roberts

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 08:45 PM

Maybe the residential will pick up soon.  It would be nice to see more people living in downtown.



#5 David Love

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 07:29 PM

I think the key questions are:

Residential for sale?

Residential for rent?

 

I'd ask those considering the southside or 7th, why not live in the burbs because you're still driving if you're going to more than one or two places? I drive through there, shop there, occasionally socialize there, but lets face it, their number one perk is their proximity to downtown Fort Worth, and again, you're driving.

 

For renters Urban Fort Worth has a LOT of options, for those wanting to purchase a home downtown there are quite a few options.

In 76102 proper you have 40+ residences up for sale, as for rentals you multiply that by 3 to 5 on a any given day.

 

One thing I've found odd is the job market downtown, as it is in many locations they tend to lowball highly skilled prospects and when they discover you actually LIVE downtown it's even worse because they know the ability to walk to work is a huge perk "they" have and you want. Dallas still has Fort Worth beat in this area, I'm sad to say.

 

I suspect residential building will increase shortly, since rates are starting to bump up rather sharply.


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#6 Russ Graham

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 09:00 PM

To answer your question as a CD resident, proximity to downtown is far from being the biggest perk. Let's see, three world class museums, WRMC, trinity park, the botannical gardens, lots of shops and restaurants... All within walking distance. And yes I do walk all these places regularly. There's basically nothing in the cbd to compare, and its rare I actually have a need or want to go there, because as you say, we have to drive to get there. I would say the main perk of living downtown is its proximity to the NSS and CD. (Just to reverse-troll you a bit since you seem a little bit proud of being downtown...)

#7 Austin55

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 09:22 PM

I'd ask those considering the southside or 7th, why not live in the burbs because you're still driving if you're going to more than one or two places? I drive through there, shop there, occasionally socialize there, but lets face it, their number one perk is their proximity to downtown Fort Worth, and again, you're driving.

 

Why do you say that?  W7 and Magnolia area's are both dense with jobs, restaurants, shops, and other amenities. Nothing in downtown that you'd necessarily need to go for. If you do need to go downtown, its 2 miles from Vue De Muse to the courthouse, a long walk for sure, but doable, and fairly simple on a bike. Or even a Taxi or Uber. It would be nice if there was a streetcar option but thats a can of worms. 



#8 Urbndwlr

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Posted 11 January 2015 - 03:39 PM

I dont think that the suburban and exurban sprawl on the edges of Fort Worth compete much with central city apartment and condo units.  The tastes of person who chooses to be Downtown is usually quite different than on the edge of town. 

 

I think that Downtown's lack of a high profile, large, attractive green space is one of the greatest strikes against it.  Someone mentioned Downtown Austin.  Downtown Austin's most high profile ammenity is the Lady Bird Lake and hike and bike trail.  The Trinity River Hike and Bike trails are still too disconnected from Downtown Fort Worth to feel like they are really part of Downtown.  I know that Streams & Valleys and Downtown Fort Worth Inc are aware of this and have agendas to resolve this through strengthening these connections. 

 

Sundance Square Plaza is a big new centerpiece for Downtown.  Its a very big deal to have that social, public gathering place with multiple opportunities for people to hang out around it.  Is a lot like central plazas in Spain, piazzas in Italy, and places in France.  The center of social activity of the district or city. 

 

The two market rate apartment projects that are in the pipeline are:

1) Pinnacle Bank Place (as mentioned above).  Appears to be moving forward, good for more density in southern Downtown.

2) one on Samuels Avenue by Carleton Residential.  I dont know the status of that one.  


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#9 eastfwther

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 07:09 AM

I'm aware that condo sales are still pretty flat in Fort Worth, so I don't expect to see any condo projects anytime soon in downtown, but I would have expected more rental units by now.  A lot of the comments  just have me believing more and more that DTFW is becoming more and more of a tourist attraction and less of an "urban downtown".  Downtown seems to be adding more chain restaurants for people to drive to and much fewer corporate jobs and places to live.  I know we've had our fun with downtown Dallas' lagging for years, but DTD seems to be doing the exact opposite of Fort Worth..and the plan has been been slower to work...but it is working. Dallas has added and continues to add jobs, residences, as well as parks and improving mass transit options.  I think this is a more viable plan for a truly thriving downtown.  A tourist attraction can be hot for 50 years and then dry up. As Fort Worth grows, it seems that DTFW is becoming less important to residents of Fort Worth and they're choosing to live elsewhere and drive to downtown instead of living there. And as more entertainment options pop up around the city, fewer of them will be driving downtown.  IMO, this has always been the Bass' greatest fear...that DTFW would have to compete with other parts of town. (Remember the trolley?).   I really think if there was a really strong interest in DTFW living, more apartments would have been built downtown by now.  I'm just not sure the interest is really as strong as downtown's boosters would like you to believe.



#10 eastfwther

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 08:38 AM

I think the key questions are:

Residential for sale?

Residential for rent?

 

I'd ask those considering the southside or 7th, why not live in the burbs because you're still driving if you're going to more than one or two places? I drive through there, shop there, occasionally socialize there, but lets face it, their number one perk is their proximity to downtown Fort Worth, and again, you're driving.

 

W7th is very suburban in nature, imo.  Tons of strip shopping centers with a few  "urban developments"  (translation..a shopping strip with apartments on top, linked to zero mass transit) thrown in here and there. And  I wish our museum district could be picked up and moved downtown.  It's a confusing car congested, chain restaurant, strip center filled mess.  However, I think the Southside could possibly become Fort Worth's best urban neighborhood.



#11 Fort Worthology

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 11:36 AM

 

I'd ask those considering the southside or 7th, why not live in the burbs because you're still driving if you're going to more than one or two places? I drive through there, shop there, occasionally socialize there, but lets face it, their number one perk is their proximity to downtown Fort Worth, and again, you're driving.

 

 

I disagree.

 

I live in the Near Southside, and I almost never go downtown anymore, except to take photos or occasionally stop in at the Flying Saucer.  Why would I want to choose between a bunch of chain restaurants when I could walk to the stuff in the Southside?  Why would I pick Starbucks over Avoca?  Why would I go to some bro-y sports bar with 6,000,000 TVs when I could walk to Zio Carlo, the Chat Room, the Usual, or ride the bike share to Shipping & Receiving?  Live music - unless I'm interested in what Bass Hall is featuring (which is rare), I'll stick to the shows at S&R and other places.  Southside's got an independent record store, which Downtown doesn't.  Etc. etc.

 

There is a lot more that interests me about the Southside than just being close to downtown.  You can visit the entirety of Magnolia Avenue without driving, extremely easily, and South Main (while still in its infancy, has three of my favorite businesses) is an easy B-Cycle ride away.


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#12 Jeriat

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 08:12 PM

 

 

I'd ask those considering the southside or 7th, why not live in the burbs because you're still driving if you're going to more than one or two places? I drive through there, shop there, occasionally socialize there, but lets face it, their number one perk is their proximity to downtown Fort Worth, and again, you're driving.

 

 

I disagree.

 

I live in the Near Southside, and I almost never go downtown anymore, except to take photos or occasionally stop in at the Flying Saucer.  Why would I want to choose between a bunch of chain restaurants when I could walk to the stuff in the Southside?  Why would I pick Starbucks over Avoca?  Why would I go to some bro-y sports bar with 6,000,000 TVs when I could walk to Zio Carlo, the Chat Room, the Usual, or ride the bike share to Shipping & Receiving?  Live music - unless I'm interested in what Bass Hall is featuring (which is rare), I'll stick to the shows at S&R and other places.  Southside's got an independent record store, which Downtown doesn't.  Etc. etc.

 

There is a lot more that interests me about the Southside than just being close to downtown.  You can visit the entirety of Magnolia Avenue without driving, extremely easily, and South Main (while still in its infancy, has three of my favorite businesses) is an easy B-Cycle ride away.

 

 

And every neighborhood needs its OWN flavor. 

That seriously needs to be reinforced with the "Core Hoods".


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#13 Austin55

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Posted 13 January 2015 - 03:03 AM

According to DFWI's State of downtown 2013 , there are 2526 apartments in downtown. 280 of these were new that year (256 on Samuels, 18 in the Knights of Pythias, 6 in The Cassidy) which is about 11% growth. Hunter Plaza and Pinnacle Bank Place would add 294, about 11.5% more.

 

Here's a graph of occupancy and rental rates.

9uHzuHf.png



#14 eastfwther

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Posted 13 January 2015 - 06:46 AM

I said downtown pp

 

According to DFWI's State of downtown 2013 , there are 2526 apartments in downtown. 280 of these were new that year (256 on Samuels, 18 in the Knights of Pythias, 6 in The Cassidy) which is about 11% growth. Hunter Plaza and Pinnacle Bank Place would add 294, about 11.5% more.

 

Here's a graph of occupancy and rental rates.

9uHzuHf.png

I referred to downtown proper.  I don't consider Samuels and those surrounding areas downtown, but if the group wants to call that downtown they can. I know the apartments that are downtown have strong occupancy rates for years, which has always made me wonder why there has been so little residential added downtown for so long. Two projects together adding 294 residences is not huge. There are single projects adding more units than that in downtown Austin, Houston and Dallas easily. That's no saying I'm not glad to see it, because I am. I just would have thought by now, DTFW would have seen at least one new residential highrise downtown.



#15 johnfwd

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Posted 13 January 2015 - 07:37 AM

According to DFWI's State of downtown 2013 , there are 2526 apartments in downtown. 280 of these were new that year (256 on Samuels, 18 in the Knights of Pythias, 6 in The Cassidy) which is about 11% growth. Hunter Plaza and Pinnacle Bank Place would add 294, about 11.5% more.

 

Here's a graph of occupancy and rental rates.

9uHzuHf.png

Thanks for reporting this research, Austin.  Putting on my statistical thinking cap, one might conclude that there does not appear to be a direct correlation between rental rates and occupancy regarding the housing the subject of this analysis.  What stands out is the apparent inverse relationship between rates and occupancy during the period of mid-2009 to mid-2011, which could be an effect of the great recession (i.e., more tenants taking advantage of the fall in rates, but tenancy declines noted after rates started rising again).  The period after mid-2011 does suggest a direct correlation (i.e., higher rates spur higher occupancy), but I believe more future study years are needed to see if this is a trend.

 

Are rental rates downtown higher than outside downtown?  My guess is the rents are high because the rental units downtown are modern and designed to attract high-income people, with the exception of the urban renewal projects.  I would guess that most high-income people do not want to live in urban renewal housing; otherwise, I believe this graph suggests the level of rental rates is not a high priority among high-income people in their choice of living downtown.  Other factors must come into play, some of which have been discussed in this thread.



#16 djold1

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Posted 13 January 2015 - 06:53 PM

What is the "average" square footage, number of bedrooms, baths, etc. that defines the numbers above?


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#17 gdvanc

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Posted 14 January 2015 - 02:11 PM

Austin, the report says the 280 new are "nearing completion", so those weren't in the numbers yet (putting the 2013 total at 2,270).

 

Johnfwd, the relationship from 2009-2011 isn't unusual; rising occupancy with falling rates (and vice versa) is normal. But, of course, rising occupancy then puts upward pressure on on rental rates so you might expect to see the opposite behavior as well. The issue is knowing which of the two is leading the dance. The nature of transactions in the apartment market isn't like more fluid markets: once a price has been negotiated between buyer and seller, it determines the price for those participants for an extended period of time. "Buyers" are locked in for the term of their lease and are protected by higher rates but can't easily take advantage of lower rates. "Sellers" are similarly locked in and can't quickly adjust rates for occupied units based on changes in demand. These and other factors (changes in number of units in the market being studied, changes in comparable units near the market, etc.) limit the usefulness of very high-level numbers like those represented in these graphs.

 

What do you make of the change from 2012 to 2013? Using the CPI calculator from the BLS, the change in price from 2012 to 2013 is pretty close to inflation: $1,637 in 2012 has the same buying power as $1,660.98 in 2013. Most of the change in rental rates for that period could be explained by inflation. Assuming the total number of units was 2,270 for both years, the difference in occupancy changed by about 18 units. A lot of things can change occupancy that much. The point is, the graph is alright for showing very high-level trends, but you really can't read too much into it. Too much information is missing.



#18 johnfwd

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Posted 14 January 2015 - 03:51 PM

Good analysis, gdvanc.  Especially the point about the dynamics of the relationship between occupancy rates and rental rates, which probably does explain the 2009-2011 period  (though I still think the aftereffects of the recession had some influence).  As for 2012-2013, you are likely correct...not really a substantive difference in the change of either occupancy or rental rate levels.

 

 Here's something worth pondering, I think:  Economists speak of "elasticity of demand," which in the macro case above would mean the extent to which occupancy rates are influenced by changes in rental rates.  But, getting to the micro level of tenant criteria for choosing one rental housing over another, I would suspect that with high-income people there is a fairly low elasticity of demand (i.e., they don't react that much to increases in rent, maybe because they can afford high rates, anyway, and they have other considerations in their choice of rental housing, such as quality of life).  Does this make any sense?


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#19 David Love

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Posted 15 January 2015 - 04:50 PM

 

I'd ask those considering the southside or 7th, why not live in the burbs because you're still driving if you're going to more than one or two places? I drive through there, shop there, occasionally socialize there, but lets face it, their number one perk is their proximity to downtown Fort Worth, and again, you're driving.

 

Why do you say that?  W7 and Magnolia area's are both dense with jobs, restaurants, shops, and other amenities. Nothing in downtown that you'd necessarily need to go for. If you do need to go downtown, its 2 miles from Vue De Muse to the courthouse, a long walk for sure, but doable, and fairly simple on a bike. Or even a Taxi or Uber. It would be nice if there was a streetcar option but thats a can of worms. 

 

In 1999 I decided I wanted to own an urban residence, there were ZERO to be had in Fort Worth, something I whined about on FortWorthArchitecture.com quite regularly, then we had a tornado, I whined about it even more, ...then 650 people showed up on the first night they had any information about the 149 units for sale at the Tower, I had my check that night.

 

Moving from the burbs to downtown Fort Worth was a jolt for me initially, but I adapted to it rather quickly and have enjoyed my time downtown since the summer of 2005. I still live downtown but also have a place in the middle of a golf course in Las Colinas, both have their perks, both have their deficits. What someone has to come to terms with is where do you spend most of your time and configure your life accordingly.

 

The one thing downtown is still lacking is shopping, grocery and household shopping, which is why I venture down West 7th, the southside is a bit scarce on the shopping side too. ...I've mapped out the southside up one side and down the other, pre financial melt down, thought it would be a good place to invest but as luck would have it, thought otherwise. I shop on West 7th but living in a strip mall just never occurred to me as a good idea. ...but it is pretty good shopping compared to the options north of downtown.

 

Museums and cultural fare are great but after you hit the new exhibits what on earth do you do with the rest of the year? ...even Bass Hall can be slow to turn over some venues.

 

As for rental rates downtown, real estate is more expensive downtown so your rental rates are going to reflect that. Factor in the 50,000+ workers downtown, "not sure if that's still valid," assuming those workers don't need a family dwelling in the burbs, and the market for those wanting to live downtown is always going to be well stocked with takers and in turn a bit pricey.

 

If you want to rent a place downtown, you have a lot of options, but just like picking a place that fits your life, the only thing you have to do is decide what you can afford and what do you want to be close to, downtown.

 

Buying a place is exponentially more complicated.


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#20 John S.

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Posted 16 January 2015 - 01:01 PM

David Love: "The one thing downtown is still lacking is shopping, grocery and household shopping, which is why I venture down West 7th, the southside is a bit scarce on the shopping side too. ...I've mapped out the southside up one side and down the other, pre financial melt down, thought it would be a good place to invest but as luck would have it, thought otherwise. I shop on West 7th but living in a strip mall just never occurred to me as a good idea. ...but it is pretty good shopping compared to the options north of downtown."

David, I totally agree that the lack of downtown services and retailers for basic goods hinders additional development. On Samuels Avenue, (where we've lived for 25 years) Lincoln Properties finished out their apartment expansion across from Nash Elementary School a few months ago and seems to be gradually leasing out most units at this time. The long announced (Oct. 2013) Carleton Properties development, a 230 some-odd unit apartment project with an 11 story bluff-side tower, shows no signs of activity since a chain link fence was put up around the property almost a year ago. The last I heard, discussions with the Corps of Engineers regarding the siting of the tower were on-going. Wish I knew more.

No other projects have been announced recently and former developer-owned lots (by Tom Struh's development firm) still have for sale signs in place. While the Villa De Leon units have finally sold, a liquidation company hired by the lenders who foreclosed on it sold off the luxury condo units at a steep discount. I haven't seen this kind of neighborhood inactivity since development started in 2004. This lull could last until the long awaited Trinity River Vision project finally becomes a reality but since much of that depends on Federal funding, I won't hold my breath on that one. In the past, I've mentioned the lack of basic retail and and service businesses in the neighborhood to be a drag on growth. There used to be a popular restaurant (El Metate, now on North 28th) and two convenience stores (Amin's in the 500 block and McClouds, off Belknap and Samuels when the Marriot extended stay now stands) both now long gone. There is the Sonic and Chevron gas/convenience store between Belknap and Weatherford but it is not very accessible on foot. The closest thing we had to a neighborhood grocery store was the Courthouse Market, which also went away in the wave of development from 2004. I've always hoped Aldi would put in a downtown market because their smaller footprint as well as discount retail model should do well in an area of mixed incomes. While not a gauge of development, the Garvey House (769 Samuels) sold in September, only interior gutting/demolition work has taken place inside...the house is currently boarded up. I'm keeping my fingers tightly crossed that renovation work will commence in the next few months. Our Victorian era house at 823 Samuels remains for sale (FSBO) but prospective buyer interest has been slack in recent months. I think it would take some kind of new project to generate any interest in further development on Samuels. As noted by others, a lot of new housing units have come on the downtown market in the years since the Great Recession (2008-2009) so perhaps the downtown market is nearing saturation. I think the pre-recession boom years of development have leveled off for the immediate future. But slow growth is better than no growth and tends to be more stable in the long run. The greatest development momentum still seems to be going to suburban areas to the north and southwest of Fort Worth while downtown progresses slowly. Low oil prices and a general decline in the energy sector are also probably contributors to slower development.



#21 David Love

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Posted 17 January 2015 - 09:13 PM

My suspicion is that we'll not see an actual grocer / market downtown, above a Walgreen or CVS, for the same reason we'll never see a package liquor store. (I think the grocery situation will soon be resolved, see below)

 

When I stay downtown it's to work on my place, take in the sights, relax, I don't keep fully stocked pantries, partially because they're disassembled and being painted, but mainly because it could be weeks before I can make it back down to get some work done, so why keep a lot of food there.

 

Unless I want drive to W-7, or walk over to the local drug store for things, I'm going out downtown or ordering out for food. This is my suspicion, if you're in the business of leasing to or running restaurants or pubs, why would you put in something that would allow local residents to side step those establishments.

 

After about 18 months to 2 years downtown, it dawns on you that you can get to your restroom upstairs and back down faster than waiting in the line your in, ...and while you're there you crack a couple 1 dollar brews to compensate for the 6 dollar ones you'll spring for downstairs. As time goes by, the time you spend in clubs and pubs decreases as you prefer smaller crowds and coherent conversations.

 

It's when you hit this point of living downtown you wished there was a place you could walk to, pick up a few things and dart back upstairs. (Amazon Prime Now, will solve this problem with 1 hour deliveries)


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#22 Austin55

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 09:02 AM

142 more units is the now confirmed number for the Hilton Annex. That makes 306 units in previously undesirable mid rises now, between it and Hunter Plaza. 

 

And of course we've now seen a rough sketch of the Lancaster masterplan which looks like it could add a couple hundred.



#23 Austin55

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Posted 10 February 2015 - 12:42 AM

I was a bit curious about this myself so made a visual. 

 

Within The Tower (315) T&P (130) Electric (106) Omni (97) T&P addition (90) Neil P. (70) Waggoner Lofts/Cassidy (65) Sundance West (59) Houston Lofts (29) and Kress (24) theres a total of 985 units between Henderson, Belknap, Jones and 30. I guess you could count the Flatiron as one to. 

 

Then counting proposed or U/C we've got 260 (T&P Warehouse) 164 (Hunter Plaza) 160 (Pinnacle Bank Place) and 142 (Hilton Annex) which is a total of 726. A fairly substantial number. about 75% of the existing market. That shrinks to 466 if you have no faith in Cleapatra to get the warehouse fixed up, and down to 50% or so. 

 

So heres what that looks like plotted on a map, circles to scale. 

 

8ic6eOp.jpg



#24 RD Milhollin

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Posted 11 March 2015 - 09:51 AM

Here is a photo-slideshow of some of the residential development in downtown and the 7th Street corridor:

 

http://www.star-tele...le12519929.html



#25 John S.

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Posted 11 March 2015 - 01:56 PM

As for the long ago (Oct. 2013) announced Carleton Properties project on Samuels, I'm increasingly skeptical of it happening. About a year ago, I talked with Prentice Gary, one of the executives with Carleton Properties. At that time, additional funding was being sought for their Samuels Avenue apartment project but the indications were that groundbreaking was imminent. A couple of weeks later, a construction fence was put up around the land (which included two older homes to be demolished) but that was the last activity seen on the site. I've since heard rumors of Carleton being in negotiations with the Corps of Engineers about the proposed 11 story bluff-side tower centerpiece but do not know the outcome. Given that years have passed since the initial announcement, I'll speculate no further. The endangered 1890's Garvey house (769 Samuels) was bought last August and some initial interior demolition work was done on the two garage apartments as well as the back of the main house by the absentee new owner but it has since been boarded up with no further work being evident over the winter. It's premature to speculate about the outcome and I'm hoping the buyer/new owner merely took a winter break before resuming renovation work on the landmark home. In the interim, the visual appearance with boarded up windows is not encouraging. The large lot next door (the former site of the 1880's Foster-Pool House) remains for sale as it has been for years. Lincoln Properties has completed the last phase of their apartment expansion opposite Charles E. Nash Elementary School but I have no idea about their lease rates currently.

 

Burlington Northern/Santa Fe has completed their second rail line east of Samuels and have permanently closed off Peach street so that now only Gounah and Cold Springs road provide access to the eastern sections of the old neighborhood. (often called "Rock Island") Given that we too have long sought to sell our 1889 (Riley-Lehane) Victorian home on Samuels, (and have come close to a sale a couple of times) real estate interest has been very light over the winter months. Personally, I feel it will take the Trinity River Vision project to get nearer to completion to spur more development or investment on Samuels. With the departure of the neighborhood's primary developer a couple of years ago, the momentum for development seems to have diminished. Moreover, the lack of any retail amenities continues to be a problem for both new (apartment and condo) residents as well as long time neighborhood residents. For a neighborhood to stay in a state of flux and transition for an entire decade is unusual but Samuels Avenue itself is an unusual area for a neighborhood being so close to the central business district.

 

I do feel long term changes will occur but for now things border on stagnation. Developers, on the other hand, are notorious for keeping a lid on pending projects until the last minute so a sudden announcement could change everything. I do feel that the future of the Samuels Avenue/Rock Island neighborhood is very closely tied with the fate of the Trinity River Vision project and how it unfolds in the years to come. I think given the recent negative local business news in the energy sector and Radio Shack's demise, that development around Fort Worth's downtown will continue but perhaps at a slower pace than in recent past years. Historically, development in Fort Worth has seen cycles of boom followed by years of slower growth-it's never been linear or consistent.



#26 Austin55

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Posted 16 March 2015 - 07:02 PM

Would you guys consider the planned 120 unit building in the airporter lot "downtown"?



#27 Austin55

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 07:32 PM

Some interesting things from the SoDT 

 

35J3Yqn.png



#28 Big Frog II

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 08:05 AM

T&P Warehouse----------------When pigs fly.



#29 johnfwd

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Posted 15 May 2015 - 07:52 AM

Speaking of which, I walked by the warehouse on the way to the PO yesterday.  I saw a water suction machine with tubing on site, and some of the basement windows are open.  So I suppose the heavy rains are exacting a toll on the floors, again.



#30 renamerusk

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Posted 15 May 2015 - 08:19 AM

Speaking of which, I walked by the warehouse on the way to the PO yesterday.  I saw a water suction machine with tubing on site, and some of the basement windows are open.  So I suppose the heavy rains are exacting a toll on the floors, again.

 

 We can seize mistreated and abused animals away from their owner; yet we seem unable to seize a building that is abused or neglected and that has become a public health nuisance away from an owner.

 

 "Toothless municipal leadership".



#31 Austin55

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Posted 02 October 2015 - 02:33 PM

Some interesting things from the SoDT 

 

35J3Yqn.png

 

 

Just to update this with some recently learned news, 

 

-90 at T&P

+2 at the Flatiron Duplex

+254 at Catalyst Lancaster 

+345 at Pier 1

and an unknown amount at the new Trinity Bluff construction. 

 

1825 proposed or U/C units downtown. 

 



#32 John S.

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Posted 27 October 2015 - 02:05 PM

Austin 55, for the record, it's looks like the Carleton Trinity Bluff Properties project has been cancelled. I do not know the specific reason(s) but it probably has something to do with their announced 11 story bluff bank tower. I know they needed approval from the Corps of Engineers and that may have been a factor. In any case, the land designated for the project, just to the north of the current apartment blocks, remains undeveloped. Since I wasn't able to find anything here, thought I'd share I noted under the comps for our Zillow listing (823 Samuels) a number of speculative built houses by David Weekley Homes just now appearing. I can't find an exact address but they appear to be near the Hillside detached apartments along East 4th street due east of downtown. Price-wise the approx. 3,000 sq. ft. custom builds are being advertised in the $760,000's and up with somewhat historic style facades. I've always thought the vacant lots on Samuels Avenue would be ideal for custom builds or detached townhomes with a vertical emphasis and views of downtown. If they also had a visual tie to historical styles that would even be better. In any event, I hope more information about these David Weekley downtown homes is forthcoming soon. Does anyone know if there's already a discussion about this new residential project?



#33 Thurman52

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Posted 08 November 2015 - 10:06 AM

Looks like zoning change for the ACH lots along summit and presidio in the works.

http://fortworthtexa...ket.pdf?rev=312

#34 Mr_Brightside526

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 08:17 AM

Did anyone ever share the rendering of the duplex to be built between the Flatiron building and future Fairfield Inn?



#35 Austin55

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 08:28 AM

http://www.fortworth...pic=69#entry925

I mentioned it there.

#36 Mr_Brightside526

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 10:03 AM

 

 

Thanks and sorry, I'm going to have to get better with my queries.



#37 renamerusk

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Posted 15 March 2016 - 02:06 PM

Did anyone ever share the rendering of the duplex to be built between the Flatiron building and future Fairfield Inn?

 

In my way of thinking, its debatable whether or not this qualifies as downtown residential or a private residence.



#38 Austin55

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Posted 18 March 2016 - 03:03 PM

Here's a graph of residential units in downtown. 

 

qg7esFq.png



#39 beverlyb

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Posted 19 March 2016 - 01:55 PM

DT and Southside Fort Worth appear to be on track to have a ton of apartments, but what is doesn't have is affordable condos. Actually the some of the downtown condos are affordable, but the HOA dues are really high making them unaffordable to me at least. Mini-Rant  :smwink:  



#40 Jeriat

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Posted 19 March 2016 - 02:55 PM

DT and Southside Fort Worth appear to be on track to have a ton of apartments, but what is doesn't have is affordable condos. Actually the some of the downtown condos are affordable, but the HOA dues are really high making them unaffordable to me at least. Mini-Rant  :smwink:  

 

Well, really, how many downtown areas in major cities have "affordable" rent? 
 


7fwPZnE.png

 

8643298391_d47584a085_b.jpg


#41 Austin55

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Posted 04 June 2016 - 01:08 PM

Per 2015 State of Downtown, there are 2,532 resi units U/C or proposed downtown. 

 

Broken down a bit more by neighborhood, that's 855 West of Henderson (Upper Westside), 519 to the NW including hillside and Samuels Ave area, 309 in the core area, and 849 on Lancaster. That Lancaster number shrinks to 589 without the T&P Warehouse numbers. 

 

http://fortworthtexa...owntown-report/



#42 Austin55

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Posted 05 June 2016 - 02:38 PM

FXageQDh.jpg




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