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Adding More Hotels Downtown

Downtown Hotels New Construction Conventions Convention Center

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#1 John T Roberts

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 09:44 AM

The convention center study to be released on July 15th, is recommending construction of a second convention hotel.  It is also recommending adding more full service hotels in downtown, plus expanding the Omni Hotel.  I've broken the Omni expansion into a different thread. 

 

Where do you think will be the best place to build another full service convention hotel.  How many rooms do you think is adequate?  How tall do you think the building should be and how would you address parking?  Away from the Convention Center, where do you think would be a good place for another full service hotel?  What about limited service hotels?  What about boutique hotels?  Also, please keep in mind that one historic office building is slated to be converted into a boutique hotel.



#2 RenaissanceMan

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 10:13 AM

Would assume(for a larger hotel) that you might look east or south along Lancaster which could be a good spot.

The headline of the FWBP article mentions "premium hotels" although that's about as far as they come to getting into any discussion about the class of hotels (apart from convention appropriate). I know we're a long way off from this and most of the very high end hotels will be boutiques for now, but I'd love to see a Four Seasons or similar premium hotel in Fort Worth.

#3 Austin55

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 10:19 AM

I'm guessing the proposal at 9th and Commerce is dead? I still think that site is prime for a serious highrise hotel, very close to transit and immediately across from the CC. (my idea here).

 

I'm also guessing the recently announced plans for a hotel on the Frank Kent site are in the works still as well, which could bring a significant amount of rooms. 

 

So in total

 

Highly likely-Sundance Boutique hotel 

Proposal-Sinclair conversion

Proposal-Frank Kent site

Stale proposal Proposal-9th and Commerce site

Possible proposal-Omni Expansion



#4 RD Milhollin

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 10:20 AM

It appears the the four city blocks currently housing the round arena are to be converted to convention floor space, ballrooms, and meeting space. I would suggest that the site be excavated to provide on-site preferred parking and underground access between the new facility and the existing convention center.  The space above those new facilities could be built to house a second convention hotel. 10th Street could be put back in place between the former arena and the convention center super block to help traffic circulation in the area and to provide future streetcar/LR access to the center at street level. A new portico/entrance pavilion could be built onto the north side of the existing ballroom building to provide access down to the underground connection under 10th street reconstruction and could house meeting rooms in several floors above street level. The architecture for the new block housing the hotel should be symmetrical in order to complement the symmetry of the historical courthouse at the other end of Main Street. Loading docks for the new hotel could be integrated into the parking facility below ground. 

 

I would leave the recommended size of the new hotel to those more familiar with existing room stock and projected needs. An alternate site for the new hotel might be to the east of the existing convention center, possibly integrated into an above-grade ballroom extension built over Commerce Street once the loading docks and small ballroom are removed and that street straightened out to its original footprint. The new ballroom and meeting space could extent to Jones Street between 10th (reconstructed) and 12th, and the new hotel built on the space bounded by Commerce, Jones, 12th, and 13th streets. Parking and loading facilities underground beneath the convention center extension, with walkways and service tunnels under Commerce.   



#5 Austin55

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 10:29 AM

^I'm definitely fond of the idea to put loading docks and parking underground, the loading docks currently are very unsightly, and probably a big part of the reason that theres been no development on the East side of the center. 



#6 RenaissanceMan

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 09:13 PM

https://fwbusinesspr...e.aspx?aid=5703

Ok so after catching this in the FWBP, I'd also like to suggest adding some hotel space (possibly another high-rise/skyscraper) to the west of the Omni by moving City Hall to he post office and demolishing the current city hall.

#7 PeopleAreStrange

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 09:51 PM

The current city hall should be the parking garage for Jeriat's Panther City tower. :) Build a new hotel south of the Omni.

 

That would be funny (and sad) if residents living at the current Omni tower had both their northern and southern views blocked by new towers.


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#8 Austin55

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 10:05 PM

https://fwbusinesspr...e.aspx?aid=5703

Ok so after catching this in the FWBP, I'd also like to suggest adding some hotel space (possibly another high-rise/skyscraper) to the west of the Omni by moving City Hall to he post office and demolishing the current city hall.

 

Pretty good idea, that's a larger than normal block so developers have more options. Perhaps a large garage could be implemented to, I'm sure St. Patricks and some of the nearby city offices could use it and it could absorb some of the surface lots in the area and open up more room for further development. If it were tall it'd really fill a nice gap in the skyline left between Burnett/777/Omni.

 

Is there really much value on holding onto the current city hall? It's architecturally significant if you are a brutalism fan...
 



#9 John T Roberts

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 11:12 PM

The current City Hall was designed by Edward Durell Stone.  He was a significant Mid-Century Modern Architect.  I am not a fan of the building; however, since this is Fort Worth's only building by him, my tendencies would be to preserve it.  As for the expansion of the Omni, with all of the high rise towers you all are proposing to be built around it, the expansion might be better off to buy out the condominiums and expand the hotel into the tower.



#10 cberen1

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 08:13 AM

Dynamite the AT&T Building.  That would be a great place for a new hotel.  :)  



#11 cjyoung

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 03:45 PM

At&t would just build another ugly one nearby.



#12 Jeriat

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 04:52 PM

Do we really even need an AT&T building like that now a days, or no? 


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#13 John T Roberts

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 05:05 PM

The last time that I visited with someone at AT&T, they stated they still need a facility similar to the ones that are in downtown and scattered about the neighborhoods.  (Yes, there are several neighborhood exchange buildings throughout the city.)



#14 Jeriat

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 05:37 PM

The last time that I visited with someone at AT&T, they stated they still need a facility similar to the ones that are in downtown and scattered about the neighborhoods.  (Yes, there are several neighborhood exchange buildings throughout the city.)

 

Ah. 
 

Well... I'm not sure about the location. Maybe it's in the spot it needs to be. Personally, I'd rather it be away from Convention Center. 

 


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#15 gdvanc

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 01:59 AM

SW Corner of Texas & Monroe?



#16 Jeriat

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 09:05 AM

SW Corner of Texas & Monroe?


...a little further away than that.

At least 2 blocks more.

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#17 Austin55

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 04:27 PM

Speaking of imploding things... What about the Hilton Annex? Prime location 1 block from the ITC and CC. I'm not sure of it's state of condition (heard it was poor, full of asbestos) if renovating it and bringing it back up to snuff is out of the question, blow er' up and get Hilton to build a new hotel on site. Hiltonb ought to have the money and I assume they still own the land.

 

That said, I'd be careful what I wish for since they've built these eyesores in Austin and Houston lately.



#18 John T Roberts

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 07:26 PM

The Hilton Hotel chain does not own either building.  They are merely operators of the hotel.  Actually, the buildings are under two different ownerships.  Also, why would Hilton want to build a new hotel, when they operate a fantastic historic hotel? 

 

I think demolishing the annex would be an excellent opportunity for another hotel to be built, but that is only a 1/2 block site.  A limited service hotel, might be a better use at that location.  I also doubt the building would be imploded.  Since it is literally an expansion joint's width away, I would bet that it would be demolished in a more conventional way.



#19 cjyoung

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 10:30 AM

That said, I'd be careful what I wish for since they've built these eyesores in Austin and Houston lately.

I'd take both over the Sheraton  and Worthington.



#20 Jeriat

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 02:57 PM

Speaking of imploding things... What about the Hilton Annex? Prime location 1 block from the ITC and CC. I'm not sure of it's state of condition (heard it was poor, full of asbestos) if renovating it and bringing it back up to snuff is out of the question, blow er' up and get Hilton to build a new hotel on site. Hiltonb ought to have the money and I assume they still own the land.
 
That said, I'd be careful what I wish for since they've built these eyesores in Austin and Houston lately.


You don't like those...?

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#21 Austin55

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 03:07 PM

 

You don't like those...?

 

 

The Austin one is especially ugly I think, the Houston one isn't so bad, still a bit gaudy for my taste.  Now the Manchester or Foshan ones are some sexy buildings. 

 

The Hilton Hotel chain does not own either building.  They are merely operators of the hotel.  Actually, the buildings are under two different ownerships.  Also, why would Hilton want to build a new hotel, when they operate a fantastic historic hotel? 

 

I think demolishing the annex would be an excellent opportunity for another hotel to be built, but that is only a 1/2 block site.  A limited service hotel, might be a better use at that location.  I also doubt the building would be imploded.  Since it is literally an expansion joint's width away, I would bet that it would be demolished in a more conventional way.

 

Thanks for the explanation John. I understand they operate the Hotel Texas, but if it's full and they need more room, they could use that site. You'll have to pardon my over willingness to implode things. Explosions are awesome under the right circumstances. 



#22 John T Roberts

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 03:58 PM

Austin, I actually think implosions are cool, also.  I have attended most of the ones that have occurred in Fort Worth. 

 

As for the hotels, I have been inside both the Hilton Hotels in Austin and Houston.  I am not fond of the exterior of the one in Austin, as I think it looks cheap, and I believe it is EIFS.  However, I do like the interior somewhat.  The one in Houston is much better in my opinion. If I had my choice I would prefer the two in Manchester and Foshan.



#23 Volare

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 04:04 PM

I stay in the Austin one when I go there for work. The interior is quite nice, and the location is great with a b-cycle station right across the street as well as the train.

 

I'm in downtown Baltimore today and my travels make clear to me just how big of a deficit exists in Fort Worth for hotel/convention space. No doubt in my mind why the Southern Baptist Convention chose this city for their event thatjust wrapped up here yesterday.



#24 RenaissanceMan

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 04:10 PM

 

You'll have to pardon my over willingness to implode things. Explosions are awesome under the right circumstances. 

 

 

Especially when the building is particularly ugly. Serves a kind of social therapy session for the community.



#25 Volare

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 04:18 PM

There should be a thread on nominations for implosion.



#26 RenaissanceMan

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 04:25 PM

There should be a thread on nominations for implosion.


Top of my list: The midrise tower at the southeast corner of Berry and University. Looks like what would happen if one of Donald Trump's towers had an illegitimate son that's been written out of the will.



#27 BlueMound

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 05:31 PM

Agreed - that 'thing' next to TCU is an abomination



#28 JKC

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 10:49 AM

I stay in the Austin one when I go there for work. The interior is quite nice, and the location is great with a b-cycle station right across the street as well as the train.

 

I'm in downtown Baltimore today and my travels make clear to me just how big of a deficit exists in Fort Worth for hotel/convention space. No doubt in my mind why the Southern Baptist Convention chose this city for their event thatjust wrapped up here yesterday.

In the mid-90's, I managed Harborplace and The Gallery in downtown Baltimore. During that time the Convention Center was renovateda massive district cooling system below grade under the center was added. It was a brilliant way to solve the problems we have today in locating central plant equipment, reducing Convention Center mechanical footprints and frankly providing cooling capacity for a densely built environment. It solved a 20 year old low capacity problem at Harborplace as we could never fit the chlllers and cooling towers needed for those pavilions on the waterfront.



#29 cjyoung

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 11:57 AM

 

 

You don't like those...?

 

 

The Austin one is especially ugly I think, the Houston one isn't so bad, still a bit gaudy for my taste.  Now the Manchester or Foshan ones are some sexy buildings.

 

 

I will take all four as we have a really sorry selection currently.



#30 Jeriat

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 04:11 PM

 

 

You don't like those...?

 

 

The Austin one is especially ugly I think, the Houston one isn't so bad, still a bit gaudy for my taste.  Now the Manchester or Foshan ones are some sexy buildings. 

 

 

 

 

Ok... yeah, the one in Austin could have at least had some different cladding. 

I actually love the one in Houston. It is gaudy, but hey, that's Houston... so it fits. 


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#31 RD Milhollin

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 08:48 AM

Short FWBP article dealing with the hotel situation in Fort Worth, from plans announced for Alliance to the need for rooms in the Museum District:

 

http://fwbusinesspre...Fort-Worth.aspx



#32 renamerusk

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Posted 04 July 2014 - 10:55 AM

Short FWBP article dealing with the hotel situation in Fort Worth, from plans announced for Alliance to the need for rooms in the Museum District:

 

"Several overnight-lodging options have opened nearby in recent years, including Fairfield Inn & Suites by Marriott on University Drive and Hilton Garden Center Fort Worth Medical Center on Forest Park Boulevard just south of Interstate 30. But there’s nothing near the museum district". FWBP

 

Not necessarily in favor of upscale motor lodges, however that being said; does the Residence Inn Marriot @ So7 count?



#33 Austin55

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 04:28 PM

"Besides the 1,000-room Convention Center-area hotel that the study loosely projects could be built by 2020, the study assumes three other hotels will be developed between 2016 and 2018 downtown that total 450 rooms. The study assumes the Omni will expand by 400 rooms by 2023, or some other hotel will add that number of rooms around the Convention Center."

http://fwbusinesspre...otel-rooms.aspx

 

 

That's quite a few rooms. The study also suggests fixing Commerce street, which could open a lot more land to be developed easier to the NE side of the Convention Center, and with good access to the ITC.  



#34 renamerusk

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 09:30 PM

....The study also suggests fixing Commerce street, which could open a lot more land to be developed easier to the NE side of the Convention Center, and with good access to the ITC.  

 

I just have to ask the question how "with good access to the ITC" is material in any way other than in a coincidental way.  It is difficult to imagine any high end hotel development relying upon an agency with the record of the FWTA. If I were one of these developers, I would be doubling down on parking garages, taxis and limos. Excuse me for being cynical.



#35 PeopleAreStrange

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 10:53 PM

Oops, I mis-counted the number of reccomended rooms in the Omni hotel thread.

 

I would much rather see one new 1,850 room skyscraper hotel than a bunch of smaller hotels.

 

-------

 

EDIT: The Atlanta Westin has 1,073 rooms (723 feet tall), and the Detroit Marriott has 1,250 rooms (727 feet tall).

 

In other words, even a 1,000 room hotel could be a new tallest tower for this city. :o


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#36 Austin55

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 11:14 PM

Just for fun, the MGM Grand has 6,850 or so.

I'd knock about 120-140 off as that's what been proposed on the Frank Kent site.

It'd also be nice if any highrises were built they could include permanent condo units as well.

#37 PeopleAreStrange

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 11:24 PM

What do you mean by "120-140" and "Frank Kent Site?"


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#38 Austin55

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 11:31 PM

The lot southeast of Lancaster and Main.ST had an article back in April. 120-140 rooms. I assume it's still on the board. Discussion about it here



#39 PeopleAreStrange

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 11:48 PM

Ok, I get what you're talking about now. I didn't realize your first two sentences were seperate, and didn't remember what the Frank Kent site was.


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#40 John T Roberts

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Posted 16 July 2014 - 04:58 AM

One problem with one super large hotel is that during non-convention times, or in the "off season", it would be very hard to rent enough rooms to remain profitable.  With smaller hotels, that threshold is lower.  Also, smaller hotels give the customer more choices.



#41 John T Roberts

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 01:30 PM

Bisnow has an extensive article on the Fort Worth hotel scene along with some vague speculation on new projects.  You will have to pardon them for misspelling the name of the Sinclair Building.  Obviously, the writers don't know Fort Worth.

 

https://www.bisnow.c...ds-more-hotels/



#42 JBB

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 03:08 PM

Good grief. Those articles that read like the social calendar column make my head hurt. The author also says that the old convention center is being torn down and replaced. I think we all know that only a portion is going to be torn down and replaced, but that's playing a little sloppy with the details.

#43 John T Roberts

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 06:17 PM

I found several errors in the link.  However, I chose only to point one of them out.  I posted it promote discussion on all of the references to various hotel projects.



#44 John T Roberts

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Posted 23 April 2015 - 08:24 AM

I sent a list of corrections to Bisnow.com.  It will be interesting to see if they fix them, or do more accurate fact checking on future articles.



#45 renamerusk

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Posted 23 April 2015 - 08:39 AM

I sent a list of corrections to Bisnow.com.  It will be interesting to see if they fix them, or do more accurate fact checking on future articles.

 

 I thought of doing the same with the intent of having Bisnow consider Fort Worth as single market or if not, to consider it a part of twin market as it does when considering Austin - San Antonio.



#46 johnfwd

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Posted 23 April 2015 - 08:43 AM

I sent a list of corrections to Bisnow.com.  It will be interesting to see if they fix them, or do more accurate fact checking on future articles.

 

 

 

I sent a list of corrections to Bisnow.com.  It will be interesting to see if they fix them, or do more accurate fact checking on future articles.

 

 I thought of doing the same with the intent of having Bisnow consider Fort Worth as it own market or if not, to consider it a part of  twinl market as it does when considering Austin - San Antonio. 

 

Lots of luck getting this glitzy publication to become more factually accurate!  Now, for some actual facts about the Sinclair building renovation, here's Nishimura's FWBP article.

 

http://www.fwbusines...5bd3c9d28d.html



#47 renamerusk

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Posted 23 April 2015 - 09:04 AM

To give some credit to Bisnow, the publication did their report by casting Fort Worth as a separate market,  Bisnow just placed the report within the wrong banner as I read.

 

Its disheartening how universally Fort Worth gets married with Dallas, but not the other way. :no:

 

That said, back to the happy news of more hotels in the city's future. :swg:



#48 RD Milhollin

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Posted 23 April 2015 - 11:23 AM

Would love to hear more up-to-date news about the proposed hotel at 9th and Commerce. I suppose that the developers are set to wait until the city actually starts swinging the wrecking ball at the "Space Ship" arena before breaking ground for a hotel that may depend on meeting business for viability.



#49 Austin55

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Posted 21 June 2015 - 11:47 PM

So just to update the list, 

 

245 Rooms- Hampton Inn

165 Rooms- Sinclair Marriot Autograph

150 Rooms- Sundance Boutique 

??? Rooms- Omni Expansion 

 

For a total of 560 rooms. 



#50 Austin55

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Posted 23 March 2017 - 02:50 PM

 

9 hotels in planning for @DTFortWorth --new tipping point in #FortWorth hospitality

https://twitter.com/...966318130520064

 


Here's the proposals that we've heard about recently

 

  1. Marriot A/C
  2. Residence Inn 
  3. Hilton Garden Inn

A Canopy by Hilton and "Full Service" Hilton has been mentioned in passing.

 

Sundance of course has mentioned using the site southwest of the plaza for a hotel, but no news on that in years.

The Omni has evidently looked at expansion as well, but haven't heard anything new on that either.

 

There was the rumor of a hotel proposed in the T&P building, which maybe is worth counting. 

 

And currently the Hampton is under construction, along with the Aloft Conversion at City Place, the Autograph by Marriott in the Sinclair, and the Fairfield Inn at the old Park Central. 







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Downtown, Hotels, New Construction, Conventions, Convention Center

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