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Fort Worth Stockyards

Stockyards New Development Historic District

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#51 John T Roberts

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 09:47 PM

Here's a link to the article that will appear in the Fort Worth Star-Telegram:

 

http://www.star-tele...es-to-move.html



#52 djold1

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 12:06 PM

I posted this to Sal Espino the North Fort Worth city councilman this (Wednesday) morning:

"Sal.. I'm sorry that you and the Council felt you had to ignore the request for a reasonable delay. I am glad the Council added some "safeguards" but it appears to me that they are mostly for show and easily manipulated.

Now we are down to the point that we must depend upon you to actively protect the historic interests of the Stockyards. It will be interesting to see if events will continue to slip by under cover as they have to this point or if you will really step up to force serious scrutiny and to bring transparency to the process. 

I am all for thoughtful reasonable progress in the Stockyards. So far it hasn't started out that way. I'm hoping that my doubts about your balance on this issue are not valid and that you will provide some real leadership as this goes along.."


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#53 Austin55

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 04:48 PM

^ Which leaves me a bit confused. I love the words by Joel, but in regard to the plans shown nothing existing gets torn down (outside of Swift, which, lets be fair, it already ruined) and in some cases  rehabilitating buildings like the Mule Barns. Unless someone opens an Applebees in there, I don't understand what character is getting ruined. Maybe I'm just taking Joel's word's out of context.

 



#54 John T Roberts

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 06:54 PM

Saying nothing gets torn down now, and then plans changing and demolition occurs while the project is underway are two different things.  A tenant may come in and want to demolish part of the mule barns.  Who knows?

 

Also, I'm going to start being more candid about things that are going on behind the scenes at City Hall.  Over the years, I have refrained from either being overly critical of City Hall or I have kept negative things that have happened to myself.  However, since this was one of the most clear cut backroom deals that have occurred recently, I have decided to be more forthcoming in future posts. 

 

One of the things that was brought out at the meeting was that the Council and the developers wanted the public to "trust them".  I would say that the public should watch every move these people make and to do just the opposite. 



#55 Austin55

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Posted 11 June 2014 - 10:16 PM

Understood. I think the developers know and understand the history, so I'd hope (and assume) they'll leave it alone.

 

If they go forward with the "Stockyards North", and "Marine Creek" districts and design the new buildings in a way that is fitting to the existing "Wild West" style architecture and don't include any particularly tacky characteristics (like, a Chilis) I see this as nothing but a positive. In particular, those two districts don't even really touch any part of the heritage of the Stockyards. They are both mostly parking lots. I'd rather see some nice looking 2-3 story brick structures than a parking lot. Sundance, for example, has done this well. Except for us architecture enthusiasts, very few people know that Bass Hall isn't a grand opera center from decades ago.  Same could be said for many of Schwarz's buildings. Plus, they couldn't do much worse than that big, dumb, Hyatt Hotel smack in the middle of Exchange. Or worse than that bigger, dumber honky tonk music hall. Those two things took away whatever heritage the stockyards had years ago. 

 

Looking back at the plan, in the North district, that 3 acre green sticks out. That seems like a great idea. You could host concerts or stock shows on it. Have fireworks. 

 

Granted, I haven't attended city hall meeting or anything so all I know is what I've read in that PDF and ST and FWBP articles and on this site. I don't know what goes on behind the scenes. 

 

 

Looking closer at the two images included in the council's PDF, a couple things caught my eye. I know these are obviously very early artists renderings, but I see a couple positive things. 

 

This picture is looking up at the end of Exchange at the XTO building. That building behind it is shown in this artist mock up, presumably a hotel. It looks nice, very nice. It's not a glass slab, or a walmart. Also, check out the goals listed. Nice. 

 

65oLx7Y.jpg

 

This one appears to be looking south down the street between the mule barns. At the end of the street there's a building depicted which doesn't currently exist. But, again, it's a nice looking building, properly scaled to the surroundings, has a similar architectural style. Looks nice, from what little I can see. 

 

7NSGNsQ.png

Sorry for rambling. I'm enjoying talking about it though. 



#56 RD Milhollin

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 12:12 AM

This may be pure fantasy but I think it would be in keeping with the "feel" or "historical character" of the stockyards area to require that whatever building or buildings are erected up where the slaughterhouses used to be retain the scale and approximate footprint of those former structures, and that architectural flourishes be kept to a minimum. The Swift and Armour facilities were massive but purely industrial in design, and to replace them with some southwestern-fantasy or other architectural style would be very misleading/historically inaccurate. But, on the other hand, maintaining the scale would give an indication into the future of what was once there, and the visual impact that it made on the surrounding area. The actual design of the new buildings will need to accommodate the purpose of the modern development, whether hotel, residential, or office, or even some mix. Of course, red brick will need to be used, whatever the purpose. The view of the ruined packing houses into the 1980's was impressive, even from a distance. Those buildings completely dominated the north Fort Worth skyline and could be seen from miles away. The smell of the stockyards will not soon be missed, except by the most ardent of field historians; when the wind shifted to out-of-the-north back in the 60's and 70's you could detect the presence of the stockyards down in Wedgwood.



#57 Zetna

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 08:23 AM

 The renderings are nice, but in my business I've seen developers w/ either good intentions or trying to "get their foot in the  door" tactics that show beautiful possibilities, but when it comes down to actual building and cost of construction they fall way short. I think this new proposal also allows buildings up to 10 stories tall....which further can diminish details due to cost vs. profit. Sorry for my cynicism, but I look at the old Stockyards Hotel with it brick detailing and cast iron work and I really think developers are going to want to do more the "spray-on stucco" look of the Hyatt. There should be good quality control of the architecture that is built there, but now that the developers have "their foot in the door" I don't know it will actually happen.

 

111631-300x250.pngstockyards-hotel.jpg



#58 Volare

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 08:49 AM

Well we sure wouldn't want to have any ruins lying around detracting from the scenic parking lot views... :rolleyes:

 

http://www.millcitymuseum.org/



#59 Austin55

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 09:05 AM

^ That is a beautiful reuse! I'd love for swift to come out looking like that. Cut a bit back on the modern edge, 



#60 John T Roberts

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 10:01 PM

Tonight, the City of Fort Worth had a public hearing on the temporary zoning overlay and the eventual form based codes to be put in place.  I attended the meeting and found that the City's Planning Staff did an excellent job explaining the existing zoning, including the existing historic designations, the new temporary zoning, and form based codes.  Channel 8 was there and had a report on the 10 PM news.  Below is a link to Sandra Baker's article in the Fort Worth Star-Telegram.  After it was over, I did a mini-tour with one of my friends from Historic Fort Worth.  By the way, I should have posted this meeting on the forum, but I forgot.

 

http://www.star-tele...stockyards.html



#61 John T Roberts

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Posted 15 July 2014 - 03:23 PM

The vote on the Temporary Zoning for the Stockyards is on tonight's City Council Agenda.  They meet at 7:00 PM at City Hall and with  all of the other cases, it looks like it will be a long night.



#62 John T Roberts

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Posted 16 July 2014 - 04:54 AM

The City Council voted last night 8-1 in favor of the zoning change.  Newly elected Ann Zadeh, voted against the proposal.  This means that the $175 million redevelopment project by Majestic and Hickman can move forward. 



#63 Jeriat

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 06:32 PM

New Marriott across the street from Billy Bob's... 

 

 

 

The historic Fort Worth Stockyards — a well-known tourist attraction and national historic district — has landed something that will be new, a 124-room Marriott Courtyard hotel.

The hotel chain picked up about 2.21 acres of land for the development of the hotel at 2533 N. Main St. in Fort Worth, adjacent to the infamous Billy Bob's Texas-concert and dance hall.

The new Marriott Courtyard hotel will also be next to Cowtown tourist destinations, such as the Cowtown Coliseum, Fort Worth Livestock Exchange Building and near the historic district's cattle drives.

"We had been looking for sites in the area, but it was a high-barrier to entry market and it was difficult to find land," Lynn Dowdle of Dowdle Real Estate, who represented the hotel in its real estate search, told the Dallas Business Journal."This site was in close proximity to Billy Bob's and the Stockyards, and we were happy with the site."

The Marriott wanted to expand its hotel chain in the historic district because of the thousands of tourists drawn to the Fort Worth Stockyards, Dowdle added. The hotel chain, which has already put its development team together, plans to begin construction immediately.

The historic Stockyards have only begun to show its potential as a destination, with a number of new developments on the horizon for the neighborhood, said Robert Grunnah, president of the investments division with Henry S. Miller Brokerage.

Grunnah and Lily Chang of Henry S. Miller Brokerage represented Exhibits Building Partnership in the sale of the site. Dowdle of Dowdle Real Estate represented the hotel, through Sunbelt-CFX LLC.

"There are huge, long-term plans in Fort Worth and this will help boost the image of the city of Fort Worth," he said.

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#64 Austin55

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:29 PM

^ Is that this?



#65 John T Roberts

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:49 PM

It appears so.



#66 Jeriat

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 11:20 PM

^ Is that this?


It is.

I just completely forgot about it.

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#67 renamerusk

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 08:11 PM



 

 

 

The historic Fort Worth Stockyards — a well-known tourist attraction and national historic district — has landed something that will be new, a 124-room Marriott Courtyard hotel.....The hotel chain picked up about 2.21 acres of land for the development of the hotel at 2533 N. Main St. in Fort Worth, adjacent to the infamous Billy Bob's Texas-concert and dance hall...... Dallas Business Journal

 

What about Billy Bob's Texas qualfies it as being infamous?



#68 Doohickie

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 10:15 PM

Dallas is just jealous of it, that's all.


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#69 RD Milhollin

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 12:01 AM

"... adjacent to the infamous Billy Bob's Texas-concert and dance hall...... Dallas Business Journal"

 

HA! Love it!



#70 Jeriat

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 12:23 AM

 


 

 

 

The historic Fort Worth Stockyards — a well-known tourist attraction and national historic district — has landed something that will be new, a 124-room Marriott Courtyard hotel.....The hotel chain picked up about 2.21 acres of land for the development of the hotel at 2533 N. Main St. in Fort Worth, adjacent to the infamous Billy Bob's Texas-concert and dance hall...... Dallas Business Journal

 

What about Billy Bob's Texas qualfies it as being infamous?

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, I didn't get that at all. 

I knew I shouldn't have taken information about OUR city from a Dallas publication. 


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#71 renamerusk

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 07:47 AM

Dallas is just jealous of it, that's all.

 

:laugh:



#72 Jimmy

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 08:42 AM

If you recall from watching Three Amigos, "infamous" just means "really famous"



#73 renamerusk

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 10:05 AM

If you recall from watching Three Amigos, "infamous" just means "really famous"

 

Nope. It means being known for something very bad or a very bad deed. 

 

When FDR spoke to the nation after the bombing attack of Pearl Harbor, the president declared that December 7, 1941 will be a day of "infamy"



#74 Dallastar

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 11:50 AM

 

If you recall from watching Three Amigos, "infamous" just means "really famous"

 

Nope. It means being known for something very bad or a very bad deed. 

 

When FDR spoke to the nation after the bombing attack of Pearl Harbor, the president declared that December 7, 1941 will be a day of "infamy"

 

I don't understand why they would use that word either, I've never even heard of Billy Bob's.



#75 Jimmy

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Posted 25 August 2014 - 09:42 AM

 

If you recall from watching Three Amigos, "infamous" just means "really famous"

 

Nope. It means being known for something very bad or a very bad deed. 

 

When FDR spoke to the nation after the bombing attack of Pearl Harbor, the president declared that December 7, 1941 will be a day of "infamy"

 

 

Yes, I know what infamous means.  I was referring to a joke from a movie.



#76 djold1

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 07:34 PM

In the Fort Worth Weekly....


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#77 John T Roberts

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 09:11 PM

Way to go, Pete!  I'm with you on this.  I have been behind the scenes fighting this all the way (and some out in the open here on the forum).



#78 RD Milhollin

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 11:14 PM

If there is going to be casino gambling it should be near the convention center.



#79 Volare

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 11:16 PM

If there is going to be casino gambling it should be near the convention center.

 

Don't you mean the Rodeo Arena?



#80 renamerusk

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 12:07 AM

If there is going to be casino gambling it should be near the convention center.

 

No Casinos!

Casinos are profitable because they net more than they lose. It is depressing watching people being manipulated by a system that wins multiple times more than it loses.



#81 RD Milhollin

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 12:30 AM

The state is hemorrhaging money to OK and LA. We have learned from history that you cannot successfully legislate morality, people are going to gamble (or drink, or whatever), here or somewhere else. If you don't want to be depressed don't watch people gambling. BTW I don't gamble...



#82 johnfwd

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 06:50 AM

I don't understand the objections to casino gambling locating at the Stockyards based on a historical perspective.  Historically, gambling was part of Fort Worth's culture when cowboys were driving cattle to the Stockyards.  Now, I suppose you can argue that today's casino gambling is so "modernistic" that it is antithetical to the historical ambience of the Stockyards as it is advertised for tourist purposes.  But, call it what you will, gambling is gambling.  Gambling today in a high-rise hotel was gambling yesterday in a saloon.  Blackjack, faroe, poker...

 

I support Texas casino gambling because of the revenue it will bring in that is going to Oklahoma and Louisiana.  And it would be a boost to tourism in Fort Worth.  If not in the Stockyards, then in Panther Island, maybe.



#83 Jeriat

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 08:11 AM

I could see casinos going up around the Stockyards area, easily. Especially where the Swift ruins are.

I could also see them popping up along White Settlement between University and Henderson. And of course, Panther Island, just for the setting.


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#84 JBB

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 08:46 AM

My objections to casinos in FW are not about morality. However, I seldom gamble because I am one of the cheapest people alive. My problem is that everyone has a dream for glamorous Vegas style casinos with Cirque shows and restaurants from celebrity chefs, while the Stockyards will likely end up with casinos like what you see in Bossier City today and what you'll see in Thackerville and Durant in 20 years: rundown buildings, $10 all you can eat buffets, and a bunch of locals shifting money from one area of the economy into another.

#85 John T Roberts

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 08:55 AM

Also, take a look at Atlantic City.



#86 Doohickie

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 10:47 AM

Oh, I think an old west themed casino in the Stockyards, and also maybe a non-gambling Great Wolf Lodge/Gaylord Texan family friendly resort would complete the ambiance of the place and put Fort Worth on the tourism map.


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#87 renamerusk

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 12:09 PM

The state is hemorrhaging money to OK and LA. We have learned from history that you cannot successfully legislate morality, people are going to gamble (or drink, or whatever), here or somewhere else. If you don't want to be depressed don't watch people gambling. BTW I don't gamble...

 

Is hemorrhaging a fact or is it merely an overstatement?  I do not profess to any religious based objections to gambling, I am irreligious. 

 

What I object to is the willingness to shift the revenue burden upon others, especially upon the working and lower income classes who are in search of a big jackpot from an industry that thrives by producing more losers than winners and who are looking for the big jackpot more than the professional classes,high end income earners and the wealthy.  I don't gamble;  I rather and do invest in the Market after doing research which I believe is a way to better ones income while increasing the GNP.

 

Even as you indicated, I don't gamble, but still I do recognize how a sophisticated gambling industry takes advantage of many, but not all, to make enormous profits; and it is depressing for me to know that the state participates in this travesty. I don't get the ethical justification for supporting gambling if an individual does not partake in it.

 

Need more revenues, then raise taxes and close loop holes for a fairer system.



#88 johnfwd

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 12:48 PM

Good point here about the regressive nature of revenue raising via casino gambling.  But, remember, too, that the working and lower classes are already being victimized by the Texas lottery system, at least that's been told in news reports about this.  Especially the scratch-off games.

 

One thing we might also consider.  The poor and working classes might actually benefit by increased employment if Fort Worth attracts a lot of people and more commerce as a result of the draw of casino gambling here.



#89 JBB

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 10:20 AM

Oh, I think an old west themed casino in the Stockyards, and also maybe a non-gambling Great Wolf Lodge/Gaylord Texan family friendly resort would complete the ambiance of the place and put Fort Worth on the tourism map.


I don't doubt that a destination resort with a casino would be a great thing, but I have doubts that we will ever see that in Texas. I would love to be wrong. And johnfwd makes a good point about jobs being added to the economy. I just don't know if it will be worth the drawbacks.

#90 renamerusk

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 12:44 PM

Oh, I think an old west themed casino in the Stockyards, and also maybe a non-gambling Great Wolf Lodge/Gaylord Texan family friendly resort would complete the ambiance of the place and put Fort Worth on the tourism map.

 

If casinos were to become licensed in Texas, it would generate a very competitive and ugly round of competition between all of Texas' major population centers; and which Fort Worth would not necessarily be awarded a casino; or unless the Casino Board awards every county of over 250,000 inhabitants; and that would be a lot of casinos. There will likely be a casino in the Stockyards and in Fair Park Dallas.  How does that increase outside tourism for either city? Multiple casinos negate the need to travel to a casino and would not generate tourism.

 

If Texas wants the biggest bang for the dollar, a surer bet for building casinos are El Paso, Galveston(Houston), Grand Prairie(DFW) and Padre Island.

 

However, I do think casinos are such a bad idea, that Texas really should not go there at all.



#91 Jeriat

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 01:04 PM

Why Grand Prairie? 

I understand El Paso and certainly understand Galveston, but Grand Prairie? (Just seems a little random)
 


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#92 JBB

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 01:29 PM

Can't remember for sure, but I believe the owner of Lone Star Park in Grand Prairie has expressed an interest in opening a casino on their property. That would make some sense. Placing one at Fair Park seems even more bizarre than that.

#93 JBB

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 03:51 PM

A lot of pics and talk on social media about some pretty severe storm damage at the Stockyards. A brick wall of one building collapsed into a parking area. I can't tell exactly where it is, but you can see signage for the White Elephant and Love Shack in the background.

#94 Austin55

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 04:05 PM

It was that abandond building that had no roof or floors, it had been used as a garage in the basement.

#95 mmmdan

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 08:05 PM

I belong to nixle, a service that sends you severe weather info, etc. based on your zip code.  I received a message about N Main being shut down between 23rd and 24th streets due to a building collapse.  Is this the same building?



#96 JBB

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 08:09 PM

Yes, it is.

#97 John T Roberts

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 08:14 AM

Here's link to the building: http://www.fortworth...wworthhotel.htm

#98 Fort Worthology

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 09:38 AM

Crazy thought, but maybe - just *maybe* - if whoever owned the building hadn't been allowed to just let it sit roofless for years upon years, it might not have collapsed during a high wind.

 

#PreservationistRant



#99 renamerusk

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 11:17 AM

My wish is that the owner(s) be made responsible for what ever expenses the city incurs. 



#100 Austin55

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 11:45 AM

Hopefully good news in case of any future development.

Fort Worth launching Stockyards design task force







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Stockyards, New Development, Historic District

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