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Kincaid's Hamburgers goes "chain"


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#1 DrkLts

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Posted 06 April 2007 - 10:10 PM

From FWBizPress

Kincaidís will open up to 15 local restaurants
Marsha Brown - April 09, 2007

Kincaidís Hamburgers owners Ronald and Lynn Gentry have finalized plans to open three more burger outposts this year, and the family has plans to open up to 10 more local restaurants by 2010.

The newest Kincaidís will be located in southwest Fort Worth at 5000 S. Hulen St., in the shopping center which houses Barnes & Noble Booksellers and Old Navy. The Gentry family will also open restaurants in the Arlington Highlands development and at Alliance Town Center.

ďIf we could clone our Camp Bowie store, we would,Ē Lynn Gentry said.

More Fort Worth locations, as well as branches in Dallas, McKinney, Allen, Weatherford and Burleson, are in the works, according to Lynn Gentry, and the family is planning on operating 15 total restaurants by 2010.

When the Gentrys bought Kincaidís from O.R. Gentry, Ronaldís father, in 1991, they werenít planning to develop the landmark burger joint into a chain.

The elder Gentry told his son, ďEither you take Kincaidís, or Iím shutting it down,Ē according to Lynn Gentry.

ďRon was very successful with his corporate job, but he took a leave of absence and we bought Kincaidís,Ē she said.

Morris Gardner, Lynnís dad, then stepped up to the plate as Kincaidís manager.

Another generation of Gentrys took the helm last year when Ronald retired and sons Christian and Jonathan decided to take their places in the family business.

ďThatís when we started entertaining expansion plans,Ē Lynn Gentry said. ďTheyíre very interested in carrying on the family business.Ē

The second branch of Kincaidís opened 16 months ago in Southlake.

The Gentrys are working to make the new restaurants as much like the original as possible. Duplicating the quirky atmosphere that has evolved over the years is something of a challenge.

ďHow do you duplicate all that Kincaidís craziness? Weíre going to take our crazy look and our organic beef,Ē Lynn Gentry said, ďAnd weíre going to grind it every day and take our friendliness to the next place.Ē

As for the familyís ambitious business plan, commercial real estate firm owner Fred Arnold, who represented the Gentrys in all three recent transactions, is impressed.

ďIím not seeing a lot of family business owners with the kind of vision the Gentrys have,Ē Arnold said. ďBut they have their entire family interested in growing their business and working in the business. That makes a difference.Ē

The Hulen Kincaidís will open in June, while the Arlington restaurant is expected to open by late summer. The Alliance branch should be open by yearís end, said Lynn Gentry.


Contact Brown at mbrown@bizpress.net

#2 mmiller2002

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Posted 07 April 2007 - 11:01 AM

Diluting the Kincaids charm cannot be good. It survived the loss of the groceries and the addition of tables, but even that lost some charm and uniqueness.

I love their burgers, but they probably can't duplicate the atmosphere.

The new locations will just be another good hamburger shop.

#3 safly

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Posted 07 April 2007 - 10:53 PM

BUT THEY GRIND THEIR OWN MEAT!!!!

That's so, so, so "Joni loves Chachi" ???

Americana, the Kincaid way.

They just need a Sam THE BUTCHER guy in the back area, and then WHAMMO! You got a Ma and Pa style burger joint.

I wonder if they will opt to the ever evolving "pseudo-sexual" marketing that is sooooo CHIPOTLE and Carl's JR these days smile.gif
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#4 vjackson

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Posted 09 April 2007 - 07:31 AM

I hate to see this happen. I understand the draw of making more money, but it seems local, unique eateries are dying out. Kincaid's has always been one of my favorite places to take people when visiting FW. It looses its charm when there's one on every corner in every DFW surburb. What a shame!!

#5 hannerhan

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Posted 09 April 2007 - 10:50 AM

QUOTE(vjackson @ Apr 9 2007, 08:31 AM)  

I hate to see this happen. I understand the draw of making more money, but it seems local, unique eateries are dying out. Kincaid's has always been one of my favorite places to take people when visiting FW. It looses its charm when there's one on every corner in every DFW surburb. What a shame!!


Or you could look at it from the point of view that a locally-owned restaurant is expanding into suburbs and giving people more choice compared with the hundreds of chain restaurants in their neighborhoods. Everyone gripes about the fact that there are too many chains and not enough local places, but then when a local place wants to expand on a good concept, people gripe that the brand is being diluted.

I for one applaud the expansion plans. At the same time, I have made a conscious effort to avoid the Southlake version, and will do so with all the others as well. It's the best of both worlds...I don't have a chance to be disappointed by the clones, but I can still be happy that they exist and that someone out in Alliance (or wherever) is getting a decent burger.

#6 Keller Pirate

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Posted 10 May 2007 - 01:06 PM

Was talking with a friend the other day and he said the Kincaid's corporate offices had moved into his building in Grapevine. He said they had taken about 4 offices at the other end of the building from his office. Looks like they are going to be the next Whataburger or maybe In 'n Out Burger. cheeburga.gif

#7 safly

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Posted 11 May 2007 - 11:37 AM

Wish them luck. You really think they could become the next Whatburger or In-N-Out? Pretty lofty ambition.

I don't think they are all that great. Exceptional service though, and I like their fries.
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#8 pelligrini

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 10:40 AM

I was in the first Kincaid's a month or so ago and they had changed their fries. It's been a couple years since the last time I was there, but the huge servings of big natural cut fries are gone and I ended up with a smaller portion of some sort of crinkle cut. They really looked like they came out of a package to me.

Erik France


#9 JBB

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 11:12 AM

I've been eating there on a regular basis for about 8 years and they've had the same crinkle fries that entire time.

#10 pelligrini

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 03:52 PM

Hmm, when I really think about it a couple years isn't accurate. How about 15 years ago when I was there regularly... but I did stop be a couple times since then.

I really do remember huge portions of long, natural cut, greasy fries. A buddy and I would split a full order and that would usually be more than enough.

Erik France


#11 safly

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 04:43 PM

I say "keep it Crinkly". That's my favorite kind of fries. Natural fresh thin cut long fries are excellent too.

Do you put salt on your fries or in your KETCHUP?

Who has THE BEST fries in ALL of FW? IYO (In Your Opinion)
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#12 seurto

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 07:12 AM

QUOTE(safly @ May 14 2007, 05:43 PM)  

I say "keep it Crinkly". That's my favorite kind of fries. Natural fresh thin cut long fries are excellent too.

Do you put salt on your fries or in your KETCHUP?

Who has THE BEST fries in ALL of FW? IYO (In Your Opinion)

IMO - Whataburger's are REALLY good, and they have the BEST ketchup!!! I salt the fries then dunk the ketchup.

#13 vjackson

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 08:01 AM

QUOTE(safly @ May 14 2007, 05:43 PM)  

I say "keep it Crinkly". That's my favorite kind of fries. Natural fresh thin cut long fries are excellent too.

Do you put salt on your fries or in your KETCHUP?

Who has THE BEST fries in ALL of FW? IYO (In Your Opinion)

My favorite fries are Chili's (even though I rarely eat there). I'm not even much on fries, but the one's there are really good. BTW the best onion rings in the world were the ones at the ORIGINAL BJ KEEFERS on Magnolia. I didn't even like onion rings until I tasted them there.

#14 safly

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 10:04 AM

QUOTE(seurto @ May 15 2007, 08:12 AM)  

QUOTE(safly @ May 14 2007, 05:43 PM)  

I say "keep it Crinkly". That's my favorite kind of fries. Natural fresh thin cut long fries are excellent too.

Do you put salt on your fries or in your KETCHUP?

Who has THE BEST fries in ALL of FW? IYO (In Your Opinion)

IMO - Whataburger's are REALLY good, and they have the BEST ketchup!!! I salt the fries then dunk the ketchup.


whataburger's are great. I almost forgot about them. agree on the ketchup, they must fridge the packets well.
Yum, getting hungry. I may have to stop on by the Montgomery location and get me a road trip combo on my way to SA.

Was there really one in DTFW at one time? If so, they should bring em back. Wood laminate booths and all. happy.gif

The Chili's answer surprises me, never really connected with their touristy menu.

Except for the Margarita's.smile.gif
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#15 hannerhan

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 10:44 AM

I prefer hand-cut fries, with my favorites being Railhead and Jobo's (burger joint in Lake Worth).

#16 JBB

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 12:58 PM

Charlie's Hamburgers has fries that are just a greasier version of Railhead. Railhead is probably my favorite.

#17 JKC

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 09:39 PM

I sure had some good and very loaded fries at Snuffers last week. I know that's not in FW but I felt like this was as good a time as any for a confession.

#18 JKC

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 09:41 PM

Did I see a Pappa's Burgers banner in front of the former Tony Roma's at 30 and Forest Park today? I thought I did but I was afraid to look again for fear of the other drivers right through there this afternoon.

#19 vjackson

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Posted 16 May 2007 - 07:23 AM

QUOTE(JKC @ May 15 2007, 10:41 PM)  

Did I see a Pappa's Burgers banner in front of the former Tony Roma's at 30 and Forest Park today? I thought I did but I was afraid to look again for fear of the other drivers right through there this afternoon.

Oh man I hope so!! I've eaten at one near the Galleria in Houston and they're really good (a little pricey). A friend of mine from H-town said Pappa's is looking at expanding into the DFW area. They pretty much have Houston sewed up. If you want a good pizza buffet, Pappa's Pizza in Addison has a really good weekend salad and pizza buffet. The salad bar is one of the freshest I've found anywhere and the pizza is excellent and not watered down like most pizza buffets I've been to.

#20 JBB

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Posted 16 May 2007 - 07:48 AM

Yes, Pappa's Burgers is going in the former Tony Roma's. Finally. That seemed like such a prime location to sit empty like it did for so long.

#21 JulieM

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Posted 16 May 2007 - 08:30 AM

Okay now I'm really hungry. I gotta head to Kincaid's for lunch now.

#22 gdvanc

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Posted 16 May 2007 - 10:53 AM

Main topic:
As a new generation of Gentry's begins to take over the restaurant, it's not surprising or unreasonable for them to look for ways to grow the business. How many Gentry progeny could be put through college with the receipts from that one store? Go get 'em.

As this happens, I agree "it won't be the same". Really, it's already not the same. The solution to that, though, is for a new entrepreneur or two to step up and start the next Fort Worth icons.

I do regret that their corporate HQ is in Grapevine.

Tangential topic:
What about the fries at Fred's? Or Clown Burger Too? Or Billy Miner's?

Took 2/3 of my kids to the Main Street Arts Festival and planned to take them to Zippy's. Would've tried their fries and perhaps could have included them here. Alas, we arrived too late so we went to Sammy's. Anyway, are Zippy's fries good?

As far as fast-food fries, I like McDonald's, Whataburger, and Chick-Fil-A. And I agree about the Whataburger "Fancy" Ketchup. That's always been my favorite. I think one key difference is that it swings the balance toward the vinegar over the sugar.


#23 JBB

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 02:55 PM

A new era has dawned in the last couple of weeks. The original Kincaid's location is now accepting credit cards. They experimented with debit cards for a short time last year, but this appears to be a permanent change. Probably has a little something to do with the new suburban locations.

Also, I noticed a couple of weeks ago that they have removed the old meat market diplay counter and replaced with a lower, unfinished plywood counter. I know it is probably a million times more practical, but I think it dampens a little bit of the ambiance.

#24 jefffwd

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 03:16 PM

QUOTE(JBB @ Jul 6 2007, 03:55 PM)  

A new era has dawned in the last couple of weeks. The original Kincaid's location is now accepting credit cards. They experimented with debit cards for a short time last year, but this appears to be a permanent change. Probably has a little something to do with the new suburban locations.

Also, I noticed a couple of weeks ago that they have removed the old meat market diplay counter and replaced with a lower, unfinished plywood counter. I know it is probably a million times more practical, but I think it dampens a little bit of the ambiance.


hmmmm. what's next? Joe T's taking credit cards? blush.gif


#25 safly

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 03:26 PM

I am sure that with their expansion proposal, a great "lock-in rate" deal was made. CC rates eat up about 1.7% (avg.) from your MC/V CC swipe sales, and that's not taking into account of other fees and adjustments for other level types of CC's. Debit will usually cost the merchant about 15cents a swipe on average. But in many cases, by allowing CC acceptance, you should increase your annual sales by 10-15% alone. It allows for "upselling", such as extra this to eat or that to drink or purchasing of Kincaid's merchandise.

Besides, CC sales is a documented sale of INCOME, so you HAVE TO report it with the IRS and state/local tax. That is why the likes of certain "WELL KNOWN" eateries ^^in "certain parts" ^^of FW most likely shy away from the use.
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#26 AndyN

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 02:04 AM

Is the original Kincaid's Hamburgers done?
Star-Telegram/BARRY SHLACHTER

The original Kincaid's Hamburgers in west Fort Worth may have to move because of disagreements over a lease renewal. The original Kincaid's on Fort Worth's Camp Bowie Boulevard is just a paint-covered cinderblock building without insulation.

But the neighborhood grocery-turned-hamburger joint has built an immensely loyal following among local carnivores who wonder whether it will still be there past August.

Kincaid's is locked in a dispute with a new landlord seeking to triple the rent and recoup related costs on the 3,793-square-foot structure.

The Gentry family, the restaurant's operators since before it began selling burgers more than 40 years ago, is now scouring the west side for a new location.

"The worst possible scenario would be to shut down," said Ron Gentry, 58, who runs the business with his wife, Lynn, and two adult children. "It's all about greed and we have a gun to our head."


Click Here to Read the Rest of the Story in the Star-Telegram
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#27 lens314

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 07:28 AM

QUOTE (AndyN @ Mar 13 2008, 03:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Is the original Kincaid's Hamburgers done?
Star-Telegram/BARRY SHLACHTER

The original Kincaid's Hamburgers in west Fort Worth may have to move because of disagreements over a lease renewal. The original Kincaid's on Fort Worth's Camp Bowie Boulevard is just a paint-covered cinderblock building without insulation.

But the neighborhood grocery-turned-hamburger joint has built an immensely loyal following among local carnivores who wonder whether it will still be there past August.

Kincaid's is locked in a dispute with a new landlord seeking to triple the rent and recoup related costs on the 3,793-square-foot structure.

The Gentry family, the restaurant's operators since before it began selling burgers more than 40 years ago, is now scouring the west side for a new location.

"The worst possible scenario would be to shut down," said Ron Gentry, 58, who runs the business with his wife, Lynn, and two adult children. "It's all about greed and we have a gun to our head."


Click Here to Read the Rest of the Story in the Star-Telegram

That sucks...I hope they are able to stay there. But one of the last comments in the article is dead on, they need a better parking situation.
-Doug

#28 Fort Worthology

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 08:55 AM

There should be on-street parking all around the place.

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#29 JBB

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 09:50 AM

The parking situation at Kincaid's is drastically overblown. Just because there's no lot with rows and aisles that you can zip in and out of in 30 seconds doesn't mean there's a problem.

#30 Fort Worthology

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 09:57 AM

QUOTE (JBB @ Mar 13 2008, 10:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The parking situation at Kincaid's is drastically overblown. Just because there's no lot with rows and aisles that you can zip in and out of in 30 seconds doesn't mean there's a problem.


Agreed. More on-street parking in that area would be a plus, but honestly - I've never had a problem when I've been there.

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#31 Dr Quest

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 10:31 AM

There could be several debatable issues here but it does appear that Kinkaids has basically had "free rent" for 20+ years (no fault of theirs). I think it's either a knee jerk reaction from the owner realizing how much they should have been getting or they are driving Kinkaids out so they can redevelop...after all, it's a pretty prime spot. Either way no one argues that the parking could be better (although has it really hurt their business)?

I've been to the Kinkaids off Overton Ridge...I thought it was just like the original, even looks the same if you squint a little. If they are forced to move I would miss that location but I think they will be fine. Won't any place they go be charging at the very least in the mid 20's per sf?

#32 JBB

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 10:39 AM

The S-T article mentioned that rates in the area were in the $15-18 range.

#33 Dr Quest

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 10:45 AM

QUOTE (JBB @ Mar 13 2008, 11:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The S-T article mentioned that rates in the area were in the $15-18 range.


I certainly know that Rodger Chieffalo pulls rank on me but I would argue the actual rent is much higher.


#34 AndyN

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 11:40 AM

I think $15 to $18 per square foot is reasonable for that area. (Are we comparing apples and oranges here?)
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#35 JBB

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 11:49 AM

QUOTE (Dr Quest @ Mar 13 2008, 11:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (JBB @ Mar 13 2008, 11:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The S-T article mentioned that rates in the area were in the $15-18 range.


I certainly know that Rodger Chieffalo pulls rank on me but I would argue the actual rent is much higher.


I have no clue, so I'll have to take your word for it. I have a hard time believing that they would be willing to fork over the expense of moving to a new location for the same rate the owner is offering.

#36 Dr Quest

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 01:31 PM

QUOTE (JBB @ Mar 13 2008, 12:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have no clue, so I'll have to take your word for it. I have a hard time believing that they would be willing to fork over the expense of moving to a new location for the same rate the owner is offering.


Thats kinda what I was getting at because this paragraph in the startlegram could be misinterpreted:

What's the dispute?
According to Gentry, Corbett sought to raise the below-market rent of $6.94 per square foot to more than $27.28 -- which includes rent, insurance, property taxes, maintenance and 6 percent of gross sales. Gentry countered with an offer of $13 per square foot -- comparable to what his neighbors pay -- plus rent, taxes, maintenance and 3 percent of gross revenues, but was turned down, he said.


The $27.28 includes rent, insurance, taxes, maintenance (triple net) and 6% on gross sales. Kincaids countered with $13 but that does not appear to include triple net or 3% of gross sales so I'm guessing Kincaids is actually closer to $20 a sf with their counter...if that is true then they are not THAT far of apart, not enough to not reach an agreement. Kincaids is probably in shock from paying way way below market to an actual (or slightly higher) market price but I think that they're going to pay every bit of that if they move.

#37 DrkLts

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 02:11 PM

"The original Kincaid's on Fort Worth's Camp Bowie Boulevard is just a paint-covered cinderblock building without insulation." as quote from the article.

Doesn't sound like a prize to any other potential tennants being described that way. What happens when Kincaid's moves out? The landlord will regret it seeing it sit empty and no $$$ in thier pockets.
$27.28 per square??? They might as well move into the Bass towers with that rent! laugh.gif

Burgers with a view! cheeburga.gif

#38 JBB

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 02:22 PM

Thanks for clearing that up, Dr. Quest. I understand your point now.

#39 JKC

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 03:54 PM

If they can't pay $27 all in, then they should be moved out in favor of a producer.

#40 safly

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 07:31 PM

My 2 cents is that the NEW landlord's price point is a bit out of market, at least for the next 4 or 5 years. Kincaid's should have had first refusals declared in it's previous lease or some sort of rent control should this exact scenario ever happen. The staple location is a MUST to keep, so you can expect sales to dwindle a bit, but they shot themselves in the foot with that costly and somewhat unobvious oversight. Surely, they could have afforded the sale price, if their terms were expressed earlier.

Perhaps that can be acheived with the CB Distr. petition and the CB Distr. will pay for any improvements should a new long term lease be issued.

The Bahama's Seafood venue off of Univ. Dr. is vacant and would be a great location for an expanded version of the Kincaid's, only minutes away from the original.

I do agree that the landlords's pricing should be tiered at best, especially with a new lease contract. Go up 5%-10% every year on a 10 year lease.

I do believe that the location, community assimilation and familiarity made Kincaid's a wonderful place to try out and enjoy. The burgs were pretty good too. Handmade and juiceeee!

what kind of worries me is that there is no indication of a tenant in the works or on standby.
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#41 AndyN

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 02:43 AM

News flash! Kincaid's stays!
By BUD KENNEDY
bud@star-telegram.com

Besides not messing with Texas in general, new Texans should be warned not to mess with some specific local treasures:

Anything involving Nolan Ryan.

Historic Main Street in downtown Grapevine.

Burgerís Lake. (Yes, itís open again. This time, keep the diapered kids out of the pool.)

And particularly Kincaidís Hamburgers in Fort Worth.

Now, Kincaidís Oregon landlord agrees.

Days before a threatened eviction, the owners of the venerable Fort Worth burger grill have reached an 11th-hour agreement to keep their location in the former grocery store where it has been for 62 years.

"We cut it close," said Ron Gentry, son of the former meat-market manager who started selling burgers in the 1960s in the back of Kincaid Grocery, which had opened in 1946.

The Gentrys had planned to close that location forever Thursday night and send customers to new suburban stores while building a new shop on Camp Bowie Boulevard.

"This location is the genesis of Kincaidís, and always will be," Ron Gentry said. "We did not want to go without a Kincaidís on the west side."

I didnít check with landlord Lois Corbett, a former Fort Worth resident and high school girlsí basketball coach who inherited the property from the heirs of grocery founder Charles Kincaid.

(Even though the name is Kincaidís Hamburgers, the grill operation belonged to former meat cutter O.R. Gentry. The land remained in the hands of the Kincaid family.)

Kincaidís has been entangled in melodrama since March, when Corbett and other heirs hired a Dallas lawyer to manage the estate. The lawyer demanded rent in six figures and a much larger share of the profits.

By the last few weeks, the lawyer was no longer involved, and the Gentrys have negotiated a new lease with Corbett through a local broker, Gentry said.

Click Here to read the rest of the story.

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#42 learsfool

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 08:15 AM

Just catching up on this thread - glad to see that Kincaid's will stay. Haven't actually eaten there in a long time, but remember it as being very good, certainly one of the best in the area.

By the way, Safly, to answer your question of a few months ago, yes, there used to be a
Whataburger in DTFW - they must have shut that down right before you moved here, as I believe it hasn't been 10 years yet since it still existed.

As for my favorite fries in the area, my vote would go to Snuffer's as well - spent way too much money there back in my college days.




#43 Okie-JR

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 02:25 PM

That narrows it down. I'm pretty sure the What-A-Burger was still there when I moved away 10 1/2 years ago. It was where Zippy's is now. And there was some place that made pretty good wraps in the space next to it or where Starbucks is now.

#44 Birdland in Handley

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 02:05 AM

Please know that this is totally ironic and not scolding.
Maybe there should be a thread for Meat. As a vegetarian, and I try not to be a scolding vegetarian; I'm still interested in vintage Mom 'n' Pop restaurants but once the comments trend toward hamburgers elegies and meaty plates of TexMex only, feh.
That said, no one my age in FW was raised vegetarian; I stopped meat only in the eartly 80's. I recall that Kinkade burgers seemed kind of like a good/sad 70's fad when I sampled them. A really homemade burger, falling apart in your hands--how hard is it to make a really good homemade burger, falling apart in your hands?
And when we start the meat thread, here's my post--How come no one has mentioned Ford's Barbecue? I was probably born squeemish about meat--hated fat, weird inarddy bits, so I loved Ford's on 8th with it's so-lean it-was- like -wood briskets. The candied sweet potatoes were actually transluscent; that's candied! And they had fried pies by the cash register.

#45 bailey

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 06:21 AM

Birdland in Handley, the old building on 8th Avenue where Ford's was located is still there. We ate there almost every week back in the late 50's and 60's, entering on the side. It was one of the best. KC's on Berry was preety good to.




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