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Villa DeLeon

Uptown Residential Samuels Avenue Condominiums New Construction

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#51 redhead

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Posted 16 November 2007 - 08:12 PM

Well sorry to dissapoint, guys, but none of you seems to appreciate how difficult is in today's market just to get something of this magnitude financed. The condo market in other MSA's is on its knees, but not here...Hat's off to the intsitution who could see the light when others could not: Southwest Securities.

As for the value engineering: Many forget how many products are petroleum-related: even carpet, for crying out loud. With building materials out the roof (pun intended!) and petroleum based products heading towards the stratosphere, just bringing this building to market for a NON-PUBLICLY held company is nothing short of miraculous...wah, wah all you want. At least someone in town delivers on what they promise. BTW, there are REAL presales...

and another annoucement in the works about the new Lincoln sites as well as a MAJOR potential sale. When the deals are real, you'll see it here on The Forum. TTFN

#52 Fort Worthology

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Posted 16 November 2007 - 09:02 PM

For my part, I was not making judgements - just reporting on the publicly-available DDRB info.

I am curious to see how the change to stucco will change the look of VDL.

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#53 AndyN

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Posted 17 November 2007 - 02:30 AM

Red, don't mistake the neighs of a Dallas mule for criticism worthy of listening too. I am estatic with the development and especially with the fact that I saw new stakes indicating that the road paving is moving forward. I can't wait to be able to drive home going past Nash Elementary at more than 5 mph! I am a little curious how sales are doing at Palisades Condos now that they are substantially complete, but of course that is a lower level market than what DeLeon is shooting for. Yes we are doing better than most of the rest of the nation, but in my office we have seen a plateau in projects lately. Best of luck to Struhs & co with the buildout of Uptown FW. Drive up my property values!
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#54 vjackson

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Posted 17 November 2007 - 06:58 AM

QUOTE(AndyN @ Nov 17 2007, 04:30 AM) View Post

Red, don't mistake the neighs of a Dallas mule for criticism worthy of listening too.

Ha, whatever dude. I just don't thing stucco will look good on that particular style. And I would think that no matter where I live. And I loved the project in it's first incarnation, so save your "dallas guy ragging on FW jibberish. I don't have the luxury of loving my town so much that any crappy thing developers throw up is fine with me. FW is worthy of quality development, not ones that fall pray to cost cutting and use of second rate materials. But I have been in Dallas for a while now, so maybe some of the supposedly pretentioness has rubbed off or could it be I just have higher expectations. Who knows or cares, but I'm happy for your rise in property values.

#55 Dcurtis

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Posted 17 November 2007 - 08:10 PM

^^^
Stucco works fine in these parts as an accent, but the problem I have with several stories of it is that it seems to require constant maintainance. That stucco apartment bldg on Henderson is an example. It seems like it gets painted quite often and they're patching it all the time. I've seen the same with several stucco structures. It may have to do with the grade of stucco used, as I think the grade can vary. This is certainly a cost cutting measure and if I had a pre purchased a condo there and you told me you were swapping out the masonry exterior for a stucco one, I don't know if I would be happy with that. Stucco chips, gets stained, and cracks show easily. I'm not sure how the bldg will look with stucco, but it looks great with masonry, and I can easily see vjack's budget hotel comparison.

And vjack, I'm glad someone has higher expectations for FW. Our developments have fallen pray to the budget axe too many times. You're right on with Cityhomes. FW does deserve better. They were a well respected builder until the Centex buyout, and after that their quality and reputation plummetted. I hated when I heard they were building in FW...you talk about cost cutters. I was hoping they were keeping their junk townhomes in the burbs where buyers didn't know any better.

#56 cberen1

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Posted 19 November 2007 - 09:08 AM

QUOTE(Dcurtis @ Nov 17 2007, 10:10 PM) View Post

It may have to do with the grade of stucco used, as I think the grade can vary.


Stucco chips, gets stained, and cracks show easily.



I think this is the key point. Stucco quality can vary a lot. A high quality stucco finish is a good finish, although it will always require more maintenance than brick. Pretty much everything requires more maintenance than brick.

I think the stucco might look great if it is done well. It will definitely look better than what's getting put on the Spongebob Squarepants hotel downtown.

I'm just saying it could be worse.

#57 pelligrini

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Posted 19 November 2007 - 01:11 PM

From what I understand, there isn't a big difference in cost for a good 3-part stucco job vs masonry. I'm not sure if that's the case the higher the building gets though.

Once you paint stucco, or brick, you are doomed to an unending cycle of maintenance.

True stucco will crack, always. If you don't want any cracks use EIFS, but that's not really stucco.

#58 bhudson

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 11:03 PM

Looking through downtown real-estate listings, I stumbled upon images of the stucco'd VDL. Not sure if it is OK to post someone else's images...

MLS # 10908274, or look in the Fort Worth - Downtown section of ifoundahome.com for an expensive Samuels listing.

#59 redhead

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Posted 07 January 2008 - 06:55 AM

New renderings are scattered throughout the website: www.villadeleon.com I also understand that a new animation for the project is in the works with Michael Potts, the same guy who was commissioned to animate the hill country Marriott's 150 million dollar facility north of San Antonio. That should make it to the website on completion. According to Donna (in sales), five reservations so far and ground is just being broken. Gotta love that Barnett Shale!

#60 longhornz32

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 10:30 AM

Bah. Stucco or Eifs systems have their place but not in Fort Worth imho. More than likely this building will be built with an EIFS system which in most situations someone could put a fist through if they hit it hard enough. I agree if they continue in this direction it will look more like a budget hotel. If your asking a million dollars for a condo make the building worth spending a million for a condo. This project looks more suited to be located in southern California with it's bad references to Italian architecture. Do we really want this great city to start to look like Orange County? What about local regionalism? Make this building belong to Fort Worth. Make it tie in to the banks of the river and acknowledge it is on the banks of a river. Seriously you could plop this building down anywhere in the world and it would be just as uninspired as it is now.

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#61 jesse

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 12:58 PM

A nice virtual tour of the building and it also shows the other buildings that are going to be built.
Vila de Leon Virtual Tour

#62 cberen1

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 02:38 PM

QUOTE (longhornz32 @ Feb 6 2008, 12:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hi everyone I'm new here! tongue.gif


You're going to fit in very well around here. Welcome to the forum.

#63 AdamB

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 03:47 PM

Longhorn... related to CurtisD by any chance??? smilewink.gif

kidding.... I sort of agree with you. This project started out nice but it seems they have really cut back on the materials they are using which is really disappointing. I will take a wait and see approach on this one though.

#64 Fort Worthology

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 04:06 PM

There is nothing wrong with stucco at all, as long as it's quality stucco. Village Homes does absolutely lovely stucco work - just look at Hilltop and Magnolia Green, for starters. Le Bijou looks good, as well.

I'd wait and see how the stucco starts to turn out before passing judgement. The fact that it's stucco alone does not mean it's going to be bad, though.

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#65 dustin

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 04:35 PM

Perhaps it isn't the stucco, but the amalgamation of incongruent styles. Who knows though, it might fit nicely with Fort Worth's other favorite architect. Pastiche might be the new Fort Worth style.

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#66 Fort Worthology

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 04:50 PM

I'm not sure what's "incongruent" about Villa De Leon. It looks good to these eyes. Nothing revolutionary, but nicely proportioned and detailed.

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#67 longhornz32

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 09:02 PM

I don't think it is so much the stucco but it just made it look so much worse. I don't think stucco is appropriate in this area as it is typically an arid climate building material. The use of the material suggests a style or location that is not genuine to this area. How many historic buildings are still standing in Fort Worth that has a stucco finish? A true stucco finish is rare in today's world as are the skilled craftsman that work with it. Typically most "stucco" buildings you see now are the EFIS finish that is usually plagued by moisture problems. It is also a very cheap material to use which is why developers love to use it. Therefore when I see it used it gives me the impression of either the building isn't referring to local architecture or money was a serious problem and the owner is not concerned with the sustainability of the building. I think the material can be used very well and one example is Max Levy's Sunlit House but I was told by a person that worked on the project that cost was a huge factor in the project and the architect had no other choice.

What bothers me really about this project though is the lack of sense of place. The site, sitting on the Trinity,is amazing. The building pays no attention to it's site what so ever. It just juts out of the landscape in such a pretentious look at me kind of attitude. The only thing it really does is maximize the number of units that has a nice view of the city in order to maximize the developers profit (which is understandable). This building has no reference to Fort Worth's architecture. If we took the illustration and asked someone "Where is this building?" I'm not sure anyone would pick Texas let alone Fort Worth.

With such a incredible site you would think the project would be more successful if it respected the river, the view and the views of others. Incorporate it into the site, make the building blend in with it's surroundings instead of this beacon of "look at me, I have money" lighthouse on the river. The weird Italian decorations that have been pasted on to the mass of the building is just the icing on the cake.

The Trinity river front is such a gem that in needs to be protected from developers throwing up the latest in nouveau rich style in order to make a nice profit. I know there's more people like us on this board that truly love this city and cherish what makes it special. I just hate to see one of FTW's greatest assets being taken advantage of by developers who care more about price points than keeping the city authentic. Such is the nature of developers but with the pressure of concerned citizens and a city council that cares this horrible scenario and disasters such as this building can be avoided.



#68 AndyN

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 10:29 PM

Wow. Hmmm.... It's hard enough to get people to agree that there is a public interest in historic buildings and preservation, but I think it would be even harder to convince anyone that government intervention is justifiable in matters of style and taste. Are you going to tell me what color to paint my house, too? Seems to me that market forces should be allowed to bear and if they can sell the units, then the design is successful.

BTW, what is the Fort Worth style? Are we talking art deco or what?

I am pleased with the appearance of the DeLeon. I am more bothered by their desire to reduce Samuels to two lanes while increasing density than I am worried about stucco. The tenement houses and multi-family residences around here are great, but it's nice to see some new construction in the neighborhood.
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#69 Dcurtis

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 09:32 AM

As was mentioned earlier, look at some of the commerical stucco projects that have stucco exteriors...constant painting and maintennance. This was cost cutting measure plain and simple and I wouldn't like it one bit if I had put a deposit down before this change. And there's another forum that has a thread discussing stucco right now, and the opinion is pretty much the same...it's a bad idea as a construction material in this area. Which brings up my next question, how are these selling? My wife has a friend in FW that's a real estate agent that says condo sales in FW aren't moving at all right now. Tell me she's wrong. She probably wouldn't know anyway as her specialty is those tract homes in North FW.

#70 dustin

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 12:13 PM

What I dont like about Villa DeLeon is that it tries to recall 19th or early 20th century european architecture, but doesn't completely get there. It looks like a nondescript contemporary building with european design flares.

this is from their website:

QUOTE
Renowned architect Ames Fender shared in the vision and created a building resembling the old industrialistsí manses built on rivers in Europe and on the U.S. East and West Coasts to stand as the premier property in Trinity Bluff.


The old industrialists' spent so much money on those buildings, using granite, marble, and expensive materials. This building looks like it is trying too hard. When you try and make something look period without fully committing to said style, it ends up looking pastiche or Disney.

This isnt the worst building I have ever seen, but I just don't think it is anything exceptional. The stucco makes it even worse. But I am sure that the units will sell. Unless a building is hideous (i mean gawd-awful), then people won't really care. Aesthetics are only for nit-picky people who care too much (i count myself among them). As long as the units have a great view, a nice kitchen, and a kick ass bathroom then people will be lining up at the door.

#71 cberen1

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 01:51 PM

QUOTE (longhornz32 @ Feb 6 2008, 11:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This building has no reference to Fort Worth's architecture. If we took the illustration and asked someone "Where is this building?" I'm not sure anyone would pick Texas let alone Fort Worth.


I'm not sure this is a fair comment. First of all, since architecture in Fort Worth spans a little over 100 years, there are many styles represented. Other than buff brick, I'm not sure there is any one style that typifies Fort Worth. To illustrate the point, ask yourself how many buildings in Fort Worth are exclusively a Fort Worth product? Second, there are precedents for larger scale buildings with some of the same design elements, in particular the surface material. Two grand and historic structures in Fort Worth have a similar feel (although not exactly the same), Montgomery Plaza and the Northside Colliseum in the stockyards. Obviously they are showing their age a little, but at inception the renderings probably would have looked similar.

All in all I think it is too early to condemn the project based on the rendering and suspicions about the construction methods. Just like all the praise for the Sheraton remodel was probably premature. Let's see what it looks like and then start to lambast the architect and developer.

#72 Dcurtis

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 02:59 PM

QUOTE (cberen1 @ Feb 7 2008, 01:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
All in all I think it is too early to condemn the project based on the rendering and suspicions about the construction methods. Just like all the praise for the Sheraton remodel was probably premature. Let's see what it looks like and then start to lambast the architect and developer.

So we can only discuss, criticize, or praise a project after it's completed?? Maybe I'm confused to what a discussion forum is. Well please tell the administrators to not allow posting of renderings, plans, proposals, etc. Just wait until projects are completed, than offer them up for discussions. That's gonna make for one really slow and dull forum.

#73 gdvanc

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 05:08 PM

QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 7 2008, 02:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So we can only discuss, criticize, or praise a project after it's completed?? Maybe I'm confused to what a discussion forum is. Well please tell the administrators to not allow posting of renderings, plans, proposals, etc. Just wait until projects are completed, than offer them up for discussions. That's gonna make for one really slow and dull forum.


good grief skin has grown thin around here these days.

i think the reasonable interpretation of cberen's comment was that in his opinion it might be premature to condemn the project based on the rendering and suspicions about the construction methods. not that we can't criticize it; just that our condemnation of certain aspects (such as materials used) is based on information that is meager and preliminary. of course, if you don't like the style or think it's out-of-place, that's a different matter.

a discussion forum is a forum for discussion. recommending against hasty conclusions was part of his contribution to the discussion. there was no foul. resume play at the previous spot.

#74 cberen1

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Posted 08 February 2008 - 07:58 AM

QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 7 2008, 04:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
That's gonna make for one really slow and dull forum.


That says a lot about why some things get posted around here. I guess I was under the mistaken impression that the point of the forum was intelligent discussion of architecture and development. But, if we can keep up the speed and excitement of the forum and it only costs us our credibility and integrity as a discussion group, why wouldn't we?

Bring on the sensationalists! Maybe we could get Ann Coulter to start posting here. (who, BTW, I saw on the Today show this morning, and she is pretty hot for a vile human being).

#75 AdamB

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Posted 08 February 2008 - 08:16 AM

QUOTE (cberen1 @ Feb 8 2008, 09:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 7 2008, 04:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
That's gonna make for one really slow and dull forum.


That says a lot about why some things get posted around here. I guess I was under the mistaken impression that the point of the forum was intelligent discussion of architecture and development. But, if we can keep up the speed and excitement of the forum and it only costs us our credibility and integrity as a discussion group, why wouldn't we?

Bring on the sensationalists! Maybe we could get Ann Coulter to start posting here. (who, BTW, I saw on the Today show this morning, and she is pretty hot for a vile human being).



Ann Coulter is certainly NOT HOT!

#76 Dcurtis

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Posted 08 February 2008 - 08:53 AM

QUOTE (gdvanc @ Feb 7 2008, 05:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
i think the reasonable interpretation of cberen's comment was that in his opinion it might be premature to condemn the project based on the rendering and suspicions about the construction methods.

What is premature or suspicious about the construction methods when the developer themselves announced the change of construction materials to the public??? The news of the change from brick to stucco wasn't exactly hearsay, the news came right from the developer to the DDRB.

QUOTE (cberen1 @ Feb 8 2008, 07:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 7 2008, 04:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
That's gonna make for one really slow and dull forum.


That says a lot about why some things get posted around here. I guess I was under the mistaken impression that the point of the forum was intelligent discussion of architecture and development. But, if we can keep up the speed and excitement of the forum and it only costs us our credibility and integrity as a discussion group, why wouldn't we?

Bring on the sensationalists! Maybe we could get Ann Coulter to start posting here. (who, BTW, I saw on the Today show this morning, and she is pretty hot for a vile human being).


You lost all credibilty when you said Ann Coulter is hot!!! rolleyes.gif Anyway, I don't see how discussing the materials used to build a project isn't worthy of discussion, be it praise or criticism, on an ARCHITECTURAL forum. And I haven't seen a post yet regarding the subject that I would consider unintelligent or maybe you're just way smarter than I am. Perhaps you are smarter than me and that's why your suggestion that we not discuss such things on a forum dedicated to such things is lost on me.

#77 bhudson

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Posted 08 February 2008 - 08:56 AM

Folks, enough with the snarkiness. And definitely enough with the Ann Coulter talk...

Can we please get back on topic? Specifically, the misguided use of Holiday Inn Express exterior design concepts. (Oops, that was snarky, wasn't it?) Carry on!

#78 dustin

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Posted 08 February 2008 - 11:44 AM

QUOTE
Specifically, the misguided use of Holiday Inn Express exterior design concepts.


Bah-zing!

#79 longhornz32

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Posted 08 February 2008 - 11:47 AM

QUOTE (AndyN @ Feb 6 2008, 10:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Wow. Hmmm.... It's hard enough to get people to agree that there is a public interest in historic buildings and preservation, but I think it would be even harder to convince anyone that government intervention is justifiable in matters of style and taste.


Well, there already is an entity that is intervening. Just check out the list of the Design Review Board's upcoming topics which include minute details such as appropriateness of lighting, sign banners, and lettering. You'll probably not meet anyone that is more libertarian than myself and I would have a problem with someone telling me what to do with my home. But without the guidance of some people who care about the city you end up with the wonderful city of Houston.

QUOTE (AndyN @ Feb 6 2008, 10:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
BTW, what is the Fort Worth style? Are we talking art deco or what?


Exactly. There's no need to think we need a definable "style" but how about having a building be appropriate to it's location, respect it's neighbors and add to the overall sense of place to make Fort Worth unique rather than a hodgepodge of "Italinesque" Disney world type buildings. The design review board should vehemently protect it's river and the design of such structures to preserve and guide the development along one of FTW's greatest assets so that 50 years from now the river corridor adds to the value of the city rather than be a missed opportunity to the city's well being.


#80 cjyoung

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Posted 08 February 2008 - 01:00 PM

What's wrong with Houston?

#81 longhornz32

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Posted 11 February 2008 - 10:17 AM

Well, not to get into bashing or much detail, when was the last time you heard someone say, "Honey, pack our bags we're getting away to Houston for the weekend!".

#82 dustin

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Posted 11 February 2008 - 11:18 AM

I seriously doubt that people decide not to go to houston because of the eclectic architectural styles. I personally avoid houston like the plague because of the traffic, weather, and highway design. I actually think that houston has some pretty interesting architecture...

#83 Dcurtis

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Posted 11 February 2008 - 11:44 AM

QUOTE (dustin @ Feb 11 2008, 11:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I actually think that houston has some pretty interesting architecture...

So do I. And for the record, there's been many times my wife and I have gone to Houston on a whim. For an inexpensive 45 minute flight from Lovefield, we can leave right after work, spend Friday evening, all day Saturday and half of Sunday in a totally different city and be back Sunday afternoon with plenty of time to hang in DFW. I know for a fact we're not the only ones that do that.

#84 guest

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Posted 11 February 2008 - 11:58 AM

QUOTE (longhornz32 @ Feb 11 2008, 10:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, not to get into bashing or much detail, when was the last time you heard someone say, "Honey, pack our bags we're getting away to Houston for the weekend!".


Last Friday.


#85 cberen1

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Posted 11 February 2008 - 12:37 PM

QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 8 2008, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The news of the change from brick to stucco wasn't exactly hearsay, the news came right from the developer to the DDRB.
The discussion point I was referring to was the extensive discussion about the suspicion tha EIFS was going to be the material used and the resulting condemnation. The builder has not announced EIFS from what I've heard.

QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 8 2008, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Anyway, I don't see how discussing the materials used to build a project isn't worthy of discussion, be it praise or criticism, on an ARCHITECTURAL forum.
It's not the discussion that I commented on, it was the all out condemnation of the project based on preliminary and incomplete information. Moreover, I didn't say there shouldn't be such opinions, just that they were premature.

QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 8 2008, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
...or maybe you're just way smarter than I am.


You said it, not me. smilewink.gif

#86 Dcurtis

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Posted 11 February 2008 - 01:17 PM

QUOTE (cberen1 @ Feb 11 2008, 12:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 8 2008, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The news of the change from brick to stucco wasn't exactly hearsay, the news came right from the developer to the DDRB.
The discussion point I was referring to was the extensive discussion about the suspicion tha EIFS was going to be the material used and the resulting condemnation. The builder has not announced EIFS from what I've heard.

QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 8 2008, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Anyway, I don't see how discussing the materials used to build a project isn't worthy of discussion, be it praise or criticism, on an ARCHITECTURAL forum.
It's not the discussion that I commented on, it was the all out condemnation of the project based on preliminary and incomplete information. Moreover, I didn't say there shouldn't be such opinions, just that they were premature.

QUOTE (Dcurtis @ Feb 8 2008, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
...or maybe you're just way smarter than I am.


You said it, not me. smilewink.gif

You must be really smart, just not very clear. I still fail to see the premature opinions. I don't care whether EIFs or real stucco is used. It's still a poor construction choice and the use of both forms of stucco has landed many a builder in court. The greatest number of stucco related suits have been filed in Texas (especially after the mold scare). Our questioning of the change of materials just seems more than valid.
FWIW, this is testimony from a condo owner in Austin responding to a someone's question regarding whether they should purchase a stucco home in Texas. The respondant pretty much says the same thing my uncle, a contractor, says..stucco does poorly in the Texas climate.

In Austin, we had a horrible issue with stucco and mold at our condo. So much so that they had to tear the entire complex down to the studs and rebuild the whole thing -- a HUGE lawsuit was won by the homeowners association over it. From what I understand, stucco is not a good material to use in Texas because it is humid and stucco is more for dry climates and there are not a lot of people in Texas who know who to properly apply stucco, so there are a lot of stucco homes with problems (namely, as you said, mold). My mother in law built a home on Lake Travis and wanted to use stucco, but her builder said he will not work with stucco b/c of the issues it presents in Texas (with the humidity and his lack of confidence in anyone being able to apply it properly).
After our experience in Austin, I will NEVER buy a stucco structure again. We lost our shirt on that deal.


#87 AndyN

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Posted 11 February 2008 - 02:07 PM

I always thought the problems were from poorly installed EIFS, not true stucco. According to the Wiki Article, properly installed EIFS rates pretty high by the Department of Energy. Are we dealing with outdated opinions on EIFS. I'm sure it earned its repuation, but does it still deserve it?
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#88 JKC

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Posted 13 February 2008 - 03:38 PM

QUOTE (longhornz32 @ Feb 11 2008, 12:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, not to get into bashing or much detail, when was the last time you heard someone say, "Honey, pack our bags we're getting away to Houston for the weekend!".


Yeah, that lil' town will never amount to anything.

#89 JKC

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Posted 13 February 2008 - 03:41 PM

QUOTE (AndyN @ Feb 11 2008, 04:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I always thought the problems were from poorly installed EIFS, not true stucco. According to the Wiki Article, properly installed EIFS rates pretty high by the Department of Energy. Are we dealing with outdated opinions on EIFS. I'm sure it earned its repuation, but does it still deserve it?



It is also very buoyant so it could work well next to the river.

#90 AndyN

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Posted 13 February 2008 - 05:43 PM

If the river is running high enough to float the EIFS off of the Villa DeLeon then either the Tarrant Regional Water District made a huge engineering mistake with the Trinity Uptown bypass project or there is some guy building a huge boat by the zoo.
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#91 AndyN

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 04:32 PM

I tawt I taw a tower crane base segment. I did! I did! I did see a tower crane base segment installed at the Villa DeLeon site!

They have really carved a shelf on the side of the bluff and things are moving on this project. One of these days I am going to break down and buy a new digital camera.

AN
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#92 apearson28

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Posted 29 February 2008 - 10:31 PM

QUOTE (AndyN @ Feb 29 2008, 03:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
One of these days I am going to break down and buy a new digital camera.


Please do, I'd love to see more construction photos around here

#93 AndyN

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Posted 04 March 2008 - 05:57 PM

They were bolting on the operator's cab when I drove by today at 5:32pm.
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#94 AndyN

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Posted 26 April 2008 - 03:02 AM

The Rock Island Tagger strikes again. I noticed the large mural on the construction offices for Villa DeLeon, which shows a rendering of the view of downtown from the building, has had "Uptown" crossed out and "Rock Island" scratched in above.

FWIW, I am not a big fan of graffitti. This guy has tagged stuff all over the neighborhood. Last vestiges of the Rock Island Gang?
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#95 John S.

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Posted 26 April 2008 - 08:07 AM

QUOTE (AndyN @ Apr 26 2008, 04:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The Rock Island Tagger strikes again. I noticed the large mural on the construction offices for Villa DeLeon, which shows a rendering of the view of downtown from the building, has had "Uptown" crossed out and "Rock Island" scratched in above.

FWIW, I am not a big fan of graffitti. This guy has tagged stuff all over the neighborhood. Last vestiges of the Rock Island Gang?


Hi Andy,

As a fellow (and since 1989) resident of Samuels Avenue, I'm not surprised to see this type of adolescent frustration expressed against new development in the neighborhood. I too saw the Trinity Bluffs logo "X-ed" out by the Rock Island juvenile gang members.

Just a few months ago, these same brazen juveniles "tagged" the police storefront sign at the corner of Mayfield and Samuels, "X-ing" out the word POLICE. In gang lingo, "X-ing" out someone's name is tantamount to a challenge for turf dominance. I'm sure the neighborhood patrol officers were not amused.

However, compared to the situation on Samuels when we moved here in 1989, the street is now a tranquil oasis. Back then, drive-by and random gunshots were a daily/nightly occurence. The neighborhood gang, "VRI" or Vario (a Mexican regional dialect corruption of the Spanish word for neighborhood: Bario ) Rock Island, was carrying on a tit-for-tat gunshot battle with Vario Diamond Hill and Vario North-Side. Gunshot-riddled bodies were found in some parts of the neighborhood and the constant flow of transients made Samuels Avenue a scary place to live in those days. Our garage was often tagged as was our neighbors house and many others. I used to pick up two or three illicit drug syringes a week tossed in my front yard. My 8 year old son once picked up and brought home a real 38 caliber handgun that someone had tossed in the grass, on his way home from Charles E. Nash elementary School. The gun, which was turned over to Police, had been stolen in Oklahoma City months before according to the officer who checked on it.

I see the recent taggings as the last gasp of the old gang criminal element in the neighborhood. Their world is quickly disappearing under the broad forces of gentrification. While I lament the loss of historic homes, I laud the developers for pushing criminal elements out of neighborhood. For the neighborhood to become completely safe, developers will have to purchase the remaining sub-standard housing and force the remaining criminal elements to ply their trade somewhere else. Otherwise, residents of the posh new residential projects may be unpleasantly surprised to find their prestigious address is shared with a local Latino gang with a long history of violence. The local Police know many of these gang members by name and can even list the neighborhood families most active in the gang. Having said that, most of the gang activity is underground and most tagging is done at 2-3 AM by juveniles on foot. Security cameras would be a nice feature to see on the new development as well as beefed up patrols and security. My wife and I used to be active in the neighborhood Citizens on Patrol program.

No place is totally safe from crime these days and Fort Worth has the same urban ills as many large busy American cities. The social ills found in inner-city neighborhoods are nation-wide.

In a previous post on the Samuels Avenue thread (under Historic Preservation) I commended developers for entering a very marginal neighborhood and having the vision and courage to transform it to one of Fort Worth's most prestigious residential addresses. As a long time neighborhod resident, the on-going changes generate mixed feelings but overall I welcome the positive changes.

John S.





#96 safly

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Posted 26 April 2008 - 12:49 PM

QUOTE
Just a few months ago, these same brazen juveniles "tagged" the police storefront sign at the corner of Mayfield and Samuels, "X-ing" out the word POLICE. In gang lingo, "X-ing" out someone's name is tantamount to a challenge for turf dominance.


Or it could be the Public Relations/Communications Director for their local Historic Preservation Society??? smilewinkgrin.gif


I mean I would have personally liked the name ROCK ISLAND to remain.

The UpTown name is waaaay too pretentious for FW folk. Right? It has too much of that 80's Billy Joel sound to it.

A Rock Island GIRL has a much HOTTER ring to it, IMO. biggrin.gif
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#97 Sam Stone

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Posted 26 April 2008 - 01:06 PM

I'm in agreement about the names. Although I love the developments, I don't like the faux New York names that are being used around town: UpTown, SoDo, So7. I think it is a little pretentious. There seem to be plenty of existing authentic neighborhood names to choose from.

#98 Now in Denton

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Posted 28 April 2008 - 10:31 AM

QUOTE (Sam Stone @ Apr 26 2008, 02:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm in agreement about the names. Although I love the developments, I don't like the faux New York names that are being used around town: UpTown, SoDo, So7. I think it is a little pretentious. There seem to be plenty of existing authentic neighborhood names to choose from.


I agree with you but if Fort Worth were to use existing authentic neighborhood names.

Then will be called hicks with BBQ sauce all over our face. With our Tractor suppy subscription. From the Dallas Nazis. Fort Worth just can't win with those guys. dry.gif

#99 AndyN

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Posted 28 April 2008 - 10:30 PM

But ya know, Rock Island is also a Johnny-come-lately name. Originally, the area was know as The Point or Live Oak Point..

I understand the exasperation of the remaining residents and only take the smallest modicum of humor in seeing the Trinity Bluffs/Uptown name defaced. But as mentioned previously, I abhor graffitti inspite of its intentions. JMHO.
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#100 safly

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Posted 29 April 2008 - 10:41 AM

Just as some would abhor in losing their town's history, one developer at a time.

Like that "GOONIES" protagonist kinda feeling. huh.gif

Rock Island RR ROOTS?
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