176 replies to this topic

[ramjet]

Here's one from the Water Gardens:

Hmm... Looking at the above pic, maybe one could think of the brown brick sides as a bow to the Water Gardens. Sort of an architectural irony - dark, sober masonry ivy from the terra firma below shooting up the side of a whimsical, neon bon mot of a structure jutting skyward, producing stark contrast and visual conflict... Or maybe, when sober, it's just a dang head scratcher!

[RD Milhollin]

Here's one from the Water Gardens:

Hmm... Looking at the above pic, maybe one could think of the brown brick sides as a bow to the Water Gardens. Sort of an architectural irony - dark, sober masonry ivy from the terra firma below shooting up the side of a whimsical, neon bon mot of a structure jutting skyward, producing stark contrast and visual conflict... Or maybe, when sober, it's just a dang head scratcher!

I still think it needs some sort of "green" relief, especially across the street from the Water GARDENS.

[John T Roberts]

Shula's 347 Grill is putting up awnings and signage. That was on last month's DDRB Agenda. On this month's DDRB, the Sheraton will be putting another sign on the base of the building. From what I could tell, it would be a larger version of the one above the east entrance.

[Big Frog II]

Had a chance to go to an event at the Sheraton celebrating the opening of Shula's 347 Grill. We toured the hotel lobby, restaurant, and ballroom where the party was held. I thought all three were very nice venues. I will go back to eat at the restaurant and let you know what I think. The only problem I saw was the valet/check-in parking is awkward. You drive past the exit to turn into the covered area. Many people were trying to turn into the exit, which caused a lot of problems. Other than that, the evening went smoothly until it was time to go. We overwhelmed the parking staff at that time. Oh well, there are always rough spots with any opening.

[Brian Luenser]

Walking by the Sula's 347 Grill this evening, I realized it was open. Guess it has been open a while but the first I have seen customer's going in and out. Have not seen a picture of it yet. Let's take a look. Shall We?

[Sam Stone]

That cannot possibly be the final signage. Did someone mix up feet and inches a la Spinal Tap?

[Brian Luenser]

That cannot possibly be the final signage. Did someone mix up feet and inches a la Spinal Tap?

Sam, you were on to something. You were just a little hasty, as they did more work on this place in the night. When I went back over this morning to tell them about your idea of increasing the size of the sign, I realized that it was not a size issue, just a quantity issue. Look at this morning's shot!

[Dismuke]

The new facade will, in 20-30 years, lead to a FW Forum thread along the ones we've had about the 1967 base of the Simpson Building: "What on Earth were they thinking?!"

I don't think so. There is a very crucial difference between the two: The original base of the Baker/Simpson building, whether or not one has a taste for its particular style, was a work of quality, craftsmanship and beauty. It was replaced by ugly, generic concrete panels. What happened to that building was like taking a crystal goblet and covering it up with special paint for the purpose of making people think that it is a cheapo 3 for $1 cup purchased at Wal-mart.

By contrast, that hotel had neither quality, craftsmanship or beauty. It was utterly bland and unremarkable from day one - and as you mentioned in the part of your posting removed from the above quotes, the very best aesthetic remedy for the thing is a bunch of TNT. So, unlike the Baker/Simpson Building, the remodel is NOT a example of something being botched up because the was nothing there to botch up in the first place.

Observe that one very rarely hears complaints about earlier buildings that were heavily remodeled in the 1930s. Two that come to mind are the Shelton Building in Fort Worth and the Ambassador Hotel in Dallas (built in 1905 as the Park Hotel). There are instances when such remodelings are sad in retrospect in that they resulted in something really neat being destroyed. But the final products of such remodelings usually have aesthetic merit in their own right. That's because good taste still existed in the dominant popular culture of the 1930s - something that had been utterly discarded into the sewer by the late 1960s and the 1970s.

On the other hand, most buildings from the 1960s and 1970s are like that hotel in that the best remedy for them from a purely aesthetic standpoint is a big bundle of TNT. From a purely structural standpoint, however, such buildings very often still have economic value. In many cases, the remodel is being done by someone who has FAR MORE good taste than the original architect and constitutes an improvement. For example, the former BankOne Building now The Tower. Before it was hit by the tornado, that building was in strong competition with Burnett Plaza for being the second most visible eyesore on the downtown skyline after the Southwestern Bell/SBC/AT&T/Whatever They Call Themselves Next Week complex. That building was not just bland, it had subtle aspects that deliberately pushed the thing in to the category of being downright drab. The new skin as The Tower - while certainly not remarkable in its own right - constitutes a VAST improvement and at least removes the building from the eyesore category.

I will admit that some remodels I have seen change a building from the eyesore category to the absurd category. In some cases, what they will do is keep most of the original 1970s ugliness intact and arbitrarily slap on a few classically inspired details with cheapo materials that make absolutely no sense and result in a bizarre contradiction. In those cases, I would submit that the ugly original is better on grounds that honest ugliness is superior to pretentious ugliness.

As for the hotel, the only real problem I have with the remodel is the orange. What on earth are they thinking? And why paint the orange on in an upside down "U" arrangement? I guess the orange draws attention to the building - but why? Drawing attention to itself is the LAST thing that a building that bland and unremarkable should want to do. The best it can strive for is to blend in and be as unobjectionable as possible. The orange gives it a sort of "third word" quality. I suppose it could have been worse and instead of orange they picked purple or hot pink. But the fact it could be worse still does not say anything in favor of the loudness of the orange. People who factor in cool looking buildings as a criteria for selecting a hotel are NOT going to stay there in the first place. They need to cash in on the brand name, or attractive pricing, good service, nice amenities in rooms or something else. It is not like they are on the Interstate and needing to use the building to stand out and lure in drive-by travelers without reservations looking for a last minute place to spend the night. If they would just tone down the colors a bit, it would achieve the status of something unobjectionable that fits into its surroundings in an okay manner.

The only circumstances under which I can see people in the future regretting the remodel is if we ever get to the point that very few examples of 1970s architecture remain standing and they need some examples as novelties and reminders of how bad things were. It would be great if we could be so lucky.

My guess is that, unless the economy goes way down and stays way down, in 30 years that hotel will have either undergone another exterior remodel or they will bring out the TNT. What they have done with it will not age well. Certainly all of the soot from the nearby highways will not be kind to the new panels and it will need a repaint or water blasting. Meanwhile, the exteriors of the Blackstone, Hotel Texas and probably even the new Omni that they are building will still be as attractive as they are today and not cry out for being covered up.

Yes, trends come and go and sometimes things fall out of fashion. But anybody who bases his tastes entirely on whatever happens to be fashionable at any given moment - well, such a person is a mere sheep and does not have any authentic taste of his own. Changing fashions aside, the bottom line is that age cannot give an ugly building beauty any more than a trendy architecture critic can give an unremarkable building authentic significance by merely asserting that it is somehow significant. The only merits that age can give a building are history and novelty. Most 1970s buildings were butt ugly and unremarkable when they were new. They were built in such large numbers, especially in this part of the country, that it will be a very long time before they have any significant novelty value. Some might develop history based on events that take place in them. And here and there one might even find a few that do have some authentic aesthetic merit. But the vast majority of buildings what were butt ugly and unremarkable new buildings will become butt ugly and unremarkable old buildings.

[Templeofheaven]

Just a thought... does it look like a Discount Tire shop?

That cannot possibly be the final signage. Did someone mix up feet and inches a la Spinal Tap?

Sam, you were on to something. You were just a little hasty, as they did more work on this place in the night. When I went back over this morning to tell them about your idea of increasing the size of the sign, I realized that it was not a size issue, just a quantity issue. Look at this morning's shot!

[ramjet]

Well, I just returned to Austin from a 3-day stay at the Sheraton. I was there for a national conference (about 15O folks) being held in Fort Worth. For what its worth, my 10 cent review:

Clearly the bucks were allocated to the rooms. The seemingly half finished outside led to a nice, but spartan lobby and common areas (nice furniture, but I think they needed more wall art); which led to really nice, individual rooms. In fact, the beds were great! Big, appropriately firm, quality, and covered with nice linens (although I've never figured out why hotels put so many pillows on beds - most of mine usually end up on the floor.) And the flat screen TVs were actually hooked up to HD stations (I also find that most hotel flat screens have the crummy analog pictures.) The staff were especially professional, friendly, and knowledgeable.

My one dig was that the gift shop only sold USA Today and the "D" Morning News. When I commented to the shop keeper "are you kidding they don't sell the Star-Telegram?" - she looked knowingly and noted she warns her manager every day that this is not good for community relations. I've forwarded an email to Starwood....

But best of all, the participants were shuttled to Sundance Square to eat, drink, and shop on two nights. And I overheard many positive comments about downtown, the Bass Hall, the Christmas lights, how they'd "always heard Fort Worth was a nice place, but had no idea how really beautiful it was" (actual unedited and unprompted quote). By the way, despite the cold, the streets, stores, and restaurants were full on these Tuesday and Wednesday nights...

[Joshw]

Sheraton files for bankruptcy:

http://www.star-tele...otel-files.html

I wonder if the Omni is taking away from their Convention Center traffic.

[ron4Life]

Shula's 347 grill, is it still operating out of the Sheraton Hotel? The signage has somehow left the building, hmm...

[JBB]

The Fort Worth location is no longer listed on their website, so I would assume it's gone. I have to say that I've never heard anyone that I know mention that they ever ate there. Terrible location and it just never really got a lot of buzz.

[Jeriat]

So...... appartments? Office space? Tear down for more parking?

Which direction should we go, here?

[Dismuke]

So...... appartments? Office space? Tear down for more parking?

Which direction should we go, here?

My guess is someone buys the thing at a very good price out of bankruptcy and operates it as a somewhat lower priced hotel.

[elpingüino]

So...... appartments? Office space? Tear down for more parking?

Which direction should we go, here?

I believe JBB was referring to the Shula's restaurant, which has closed. The hotel is still open, and from the sounds of things, is going to be booked solid during the state Republican convention.

[Jeriat]

So...... appartments? Office space? Tear down for more parking?

Which direction should we go, here?

I believe JBB was referring to the Shula's restaurant, which has closed. The hotel is still open, and from the sounds of things, is going to be booked solid during the state Republican convention.

Oh. Must have read that wrong...

[RD Milhollin]

The saga continues:

http://www.star-tele...nce-to-buy.html

Dallas-based Prism Hotels and Resorts will be bidding against the former owners of the Fort Worth Sheraton in bankruptcy court. The judge says he wants the case disposed of quickly, by the end of the year. Prism wants to keep the Sheraton franchise, I think that would be a good thing; Fort Worth needs the Sheraton brand downtown. It is recognized, if conventional, but changing the name again would cause confusion in the market, and result in extra costs. Presidio, the company that acquired and remodeled the long-time semi-abandoned property across from the southern end of the Convention Center but then defaulted on loans will bid as well. It is a shame that they were forced to relinquish the property after doing what appears to be a fine job of rehabbing and bringing back to life a facility that was thought by some as best scrapped. The city needs to get busy and book more meetings and events into the Convention Center so it can pay for the extensive remodeling done over the past few years and the hotels have located here and that depend on those meetings can stay in business.

[John T Roberts]

RD, you bring up an interesting point about the Convention Center. I'm wondering how many conventions the center books every year. It seems like there's always something going on at the center when I'm on that end of town.

[Ron Payne]

As I drive past the Convention Center every morning and every evening, I can confirm that it does seem to be busy most of the time. Very few weekends go by without crowds of some sort filing in and out of the buildings, and there are times where it's a daily occurrence. There seem to be a lot of conferences or seminars with goofy, er, clever logos hanging over the doors indicating one get-rich-quick scheme or another, but they definitely bring in the suckers, er, attendees!

[prideftw]

It is busy. I work with MHMR of Tarrant County supported employment for special needs, and we have just sent a client there for employment as a dish washer.

[RD Milhollin]

The Presidio folks are back. New renovations are coming according to the S-T story.

 

http://www.star-tele...adlines-default

[ramjet]

Good news about a reno.  The hotel has a lot of potential, but has not been up to par as a Sheraton on my last visits there.  Maybe they can also do something to tie together all the different architectural and design elements of the building. Holy cow, there's just lot going on with hotel's exterior.  And not really in a good way.

[prideftw]

I hope they modernize the design some. I mean I think it would be a good way to compete with the other hotels.

[cberen1]

I think they could just change the color on the yellow part to something that belnds better with the brown brick.  The beige color is probably ok.  The yellow is garish.

[BlueMound]

They are finally painting the South facing of the Sheraton !!

[Jeriat]

They are finally painting the South facing of the Sheraton !!

...they weren't finished?

[John T Roberts]

They were not.  They stopped painting the building quite some time ago.  The south side of the building was only partially repainted.

[Stadtplan]

This is a major renovation project!

 

https://www.tdlr.tex.../TABS2022016378

 

PROJECT

Project Name: SFW Guestroom Renovations

Project Number: TABS2022016378

Facility Name: Sheraton Fort worth Downtown Hotel

Location Address: 1701 Commerce Street

Fort Worth, TX 76102

Location County: Tarrant

Start Date: 5/9/2022

Completion Date: 3/10/2023

Estimated Cost: $16,000,000

Type of Work: Renovation/Alteration

Type of Funds: This project is privately funded, on private land for private use.

Scope of Work: Renovation of 403 existing guestrooms and the public corridor directly in front of the guestrooms within two (2) existing hotel towers. Scope also includes renovation of the existing guest club lounge in one of the towers.

Square Footage: 222,552 ft 2

Are the private funds provided by the tenant? No

 

OWNER

Owner Name: 1701 Commerce Acquisition, LLC

Owner Address:

6972 Professional Parkway East

Saratota, Florida 34240

 

TENANT

Not Assigned

 

DESIGN FIRM

Design Firm Name: HKS Inc.

Design Firm Address: 350 N. St. Paul St. Suite 100

Dallas, Texas 75201

Design Firm Phone: (214) 969-5599

[Stadtplan]

https://accela.fortw...ShowInspection=

 

Project Description:

X Team /// Sheraton - SOUTH TOWER

X Team /// SOUTH TOWER /// Please refer to PB22-07791 for plans/// This project includes the renovation of 403 guestrooms at an existing, fully operational hotel. Renovation will take place at two separate hotel guestroom towers (North and South) on levels 03 thru 12 including renovation of the existing Club Lounge in the South Tower. Renovation is expected to be phased. The first tower will be renovated while the second tower remains operational. Once the first tower is complete, the second tower will then be renovated. Hotel operations will continue throughout the renovation. A separate building permit package will be submitted for the public space renovation which is also expected to take place while the hotel remains

 

https://accela.fortw...ShowInspection=

 

Project Description:

X Team /// Sheraton - NORTH TOWER

X Team /// NORTH TOWER This project includes the renovation of 403 guestrooms at an existing, fully operational hotel. Renovation will take place at two separate hotel guestroom towers (North and South) on levels 03 thru 12 including renovation of the existing Club Lounge in the South Tower. Renovation is expected to be phased. The first tower will be renovated while the second tower remains operational. Once the first tower is complete, the second tower will then be renovated. Hotel operations will continue throughout the renovation. A separate building permit package will be submitted for the public space renovation which is also expected to take place while the hotel remains

[John T Roberts]

The story of the hotel renovations has been posted in the Fort Worth Report.

 

https://fortworthrep...nd-of-downtown/

[Stadtplan]

Thanks for finding that article.  I just assumed this project fell on deaf ears when I posted it back in May.  Nice to see someone picked it up.

[John T Roberts]

You're welcome.  I try to keep up with things as much as I can.

[youngalum]

The story of the hotel renovations has been posted in the Fort Worth Report.

 

https://fortworthrep...nd-of-downtown/

Fort Worth will look like the Denver renovations exactly--see model room in article and actual Denver room below

 

https://www.google.com/travel/hotels/entity/CgoInpL02K27oc4OEAE/lightbox/CAESYmh0dHBzOi8vZDJoeXoyYmZpZjNjcjguY2xvdWRmcm9udC5uZXQvaW1hZ2VSZXBvLzcvMC8xMzAvOTUwLzYxL2RlbmRzLWNpdHktdmlldy0xODI1LWhvci1jbHNjX08uanBn?g2lb=2502548%2C2503771%2C2503781%2C4258168%2C4270442%2C4284970%2C4291517%2C4306835%2C4597339%2C4718358%2C4723331%2C4757164%2C4814050%2C4816977%2C4826689%2C4842756%2C4849797%2C4850738%2C4852066%2C4856937%2C4860391%2C4861687&hl=en-US&gl=us&ssta=1&grf=EmMKLAgOEigSJnIkKiIKBwjmDxAMGBISBwjmDxAMGBQgADAeQMoCSgcI5g8QCRgcCjMIDBIvEi2yASoSKAomCiQweDg3NmM3OGQ0MzBhZjhlZjE6MHhlOWM4NWRhZGIxZDA5MWU&rp=EJ6S9Nitu6HODhCekvTYrbuhzg44AkAASAHAAQI&ictx=1&sa=X&ved=0CAAQ5JsGahcKEwjIoParrLj6AhUAAAAAHQAAAAAQAw&utm_campaign=sharing&utm_medium=link&utm_source=htls 

[Stadtplan]

https://www.tdlr.tex.../TABS2023006001

 

PROJECT

Project Name: SFW Public Area Renovation

Project Number: TABS2023006001

Facility Name: Sheraton Fort Worth Downtown Hotel

Location Address: 1701 Commerce Street

Fort Worth, TX 76102

Location County: Tarrant

Start Date: 1/30/2023

Completion Date: 3/29/2023

Estimated Cost: $18,100,000

Type of Work: Renovation/Alteration

Type of Funds: This project is privately funded, on private land for private use.

Scope of Work: Renovation of the first and second floor existing public areas. Scope includes renovation of reception, lounge, restaurant, bar, ballroom, prefunction, meeting areas and restrooms. Also updates at the exterior entry and hotel arrival court.

Square Footage: 58,858 ft 2

 

OWNER

Owner Name:

1701 Commerce Acquisition, LLC

Owner Address:

6972 Professional Parkway East

Saratota, Florida 34240

 

TENANT

Not Assigned

 

DESIGN FIRM

Design Firm Name: HKS Inc.

Design Firm Address: 350 N. St. Paul St. Suite 100 Dallas, Texas 34240

[TLA]

Wow quick turnaround and expensive. $300k per day? I’m unknowledgeable on these costs estimates. Is it fair they would include all the new furniture or kitchen remodelling including commercial appliances?

[Stadtplan]

My guess is the estimate includes both labor and material for construction as well as OFCI (Owner furnished/contractor installed) material. Theres another phase of the project I posted above for the guest room tower renovation with a March substantial completion date.

Project Description
This project includes the renovation of 403 guestrooms at an existing, fully operational hotel. Renovation will take place at two separate hotel guestroom towers (North and South) on levels 03 thru 12 including renovation of the existing Club Lounge in the South Tower. Renovation is expected to be phased. The first tower will be renovated while the second tower remains operational. Once the first tower is complete, the second tower will then be renovated. Hotel operations will continue throughout the renovation. A separate building permit package will be submitted for the public space renovation which is also expected to take place while the hotel remains operational.

[John T Roberts]

I file these applications for every project that I prepare the construction documents.  The estimate is based on the total cost of the project that the contractor is providing.  It always includes the labor and the materials, and usually does include OFCI items.  Another factor in the cost is that the hotel is remaining open.  Phasing these projects and keeping the buildings operational increases the cost. 

[TLA]

Thank you for the detailed responses!

Judging by the renovated Denver location. If they added in a Yard House restaurant, thats a great pickup for this side of downtown.

[John T Roberts]

A Yard House would make a great addition.  However, I have noticed that every branded restaurant in the hotel seems to have failed. 

[johnfwd]

I hope these renovations increase the number of patrons at this pleasant and friendly hotel.  Last summer the hotel graciously hosted meeting space for a small group of which I am a member, and without charge in exchange for advertising by our group.  I found attendance at the restaurants not all that great, but the food and service were okay.

[Stadtplan]

It was interesting at the DDRB on Thursday last week after they heard the case for the Sheraton sign project, the board chair expressed his concern / urgency for the hotel to submit their plans to the DDRB for review.  I think staff told them they had but after listening to the sign contractor really talk up all the changes to the property that are underway, I think that caught my attention as well as the chairperson's attention too.

 

Staff Report on new sign: https://www.fortwort...taff-report.pdf

 

I checked Accela, but haven't seen a DDRB filing as of yet.

 

I did see that there was a monument sign for the hotel and something called "West + Stone" which makes me think of a spa name, but I didn't see mention of a spa in the hotel, is there one?

[elpingüino]

Star-Telegram on the renovations. West + Stone is a "high-concept eatery."
https://www.star-tel...e269698541.html

Renderings:

[Stadtplan]

Thanks for posting. I bet this hotel will be plenty (more) busy once Aggieland North is completed.

[Stadtplan]

https://www.hotelman...oes-renovations

 

"Sheraton Fort Worth Downtown starts renovations"

[Crestline]

Idle thought: Sheraton ought to build a third tower in that grass lot to the south, on Lancaster. 

[Jeriat]

Idle thought: Sheraton ought to build a third tower in that grass lot to the south, on Lancaster. 

I don't disagree with that idea, but I've always thought of something else being put there.

[Stadtplan]

Are we talking about this area here in aqua?  On TAD, it doesn't look like that is not pulling up anything, wondering if that's not right-of-way for US-287?

 

 

Funny, this whole area circled here is not showing up as deeded property, maybe City or TXDOT owned?

[Austin55]

The hotel also owns the whole block south of 16th (labeled in the screenshot as 42452307)

[Stadtplan]

The hotel also owns the whole block south of 16th (labeled in the screenshot as 42452307)

 

I bet A&M would love to buy that lot.  Interested to see what happens with that lot if 1701 Commerce group does with it.