215 replies to this topic

[Doohickie]

As for the mention of South Main, I think it's already happening. There are several new businesses coming in between Fairmount and downtown, and some new housing. It's several blocks west of Main, but have you been to Melt Ice Creams on Rosedale just west of Hemphill? They're always busy. They (along with Stir Crazy Baked Goods) are showing that merchants can do well in that part of town.

[johnfwd]

I hope South Main revitalization continues the momentum throughout the area south of Lancaster Avenue and west of I-35, including the blight of empty warehouse-type structures  Is the old Stafford-Lowden printing company building (west Daggett) re-occupied?  My late father was a printer-pressman working there many years ago.

 

Regarding the comparison of Linwood and Como neighborhoods, Linwood was ripe for project developers to take over because it was hardly alive as a neighborhood.  In contrast, Como has been, and still is, a living community.  I see parts of it being gentrified, but not the kind of large-scale project envisioned for Linwood. 

[Doohickie]

Yes, that's true. I occasionally hear of neighborhood events there via Facebook, etc.

[Austin55]

Is Como a black neighborhood? And by revitalize, do y'all mean refurbish our treat down and build New?
?

[Doohickie]

Yep.

[cberen1]

Is Como a black neighborhood? And by revitalize, do y'all mean refurbish our treat down and build New?
?

 

I think tear down and build new would work well in Como, but the folks living there may not want to move.  It won't happen fast.  That's for sure.

[johnfwd]

I doubt if it will happen, at least in my lifetime.  Having grown up around this area (going to Catholic parochial school near Horne Street) and driving through it along Horne or Bryant Irvin from time to time over the years, I always got the impression of a slow-moving, relatively peaceful  environment, but with a thriving sense of community.  Not much commercial, but old residential.  Yes, it has had a reputation for crime on a weekend evening, maybe because of drugs and probably around the run-down taverns.  And, yes, it's predominantly black.  While some offices have been built along Vickery south of Como, the interior would benefit from more up-scale commercialization, if that's possible there.

[renamerusk]

Yep.

 

A neighborhood so strategically located as Como, economic forces being what they will be, a change is inevitable.  Land values in the near west zip codes continue to rise and so do tax appraisals.The State-Thomas Neighborhood in Dallas experienced such a change. 

 

" From Wiki" - Fort Worth has been investing in the infrastrucure of the Como neighborhood to encourage a diverse mix of socio-economic residents  Certainly, this is the right thing to do.

[RenaissanceMan]

Yep.

 
A neighborhood so strategically located as Como, economic forces being what they will be, a change is inevitable.  Land values in the near west zip codes continue to rise and so do tax appraisals.The State-Thomas Neighborhood in Dallas experienced such a change. 
 
" From Wiki" - Fort Worth has been investing in the infrastrucure of the Como neighborhood to encourage a diverse mix of socio-economic residents  Certainly, this is the right thing to do.

Given that Como has one of the strongest senses of identity/community of any neighborhood in Fort Worth, I think that the real question is, how do you support the improvement of existing properties, the reduction of crime, the addition of new complementary, high quality development, while still preserving the best of its existing character and not trying to transform it into something it is not, never has been and probably never should be.

[cberen1]

Given that Como has one of the strongest senses of identity/community of any neighborhood in Fort Worth, I think that the real question is, how do you support the improvement of existing properties, the reduction of crime, the addition of new complementary, high quality development, while still preserving the best of its existing character and not trying to transform it into something it is not, never has been and probably never should be.

 

To me this is a little bit like trying to build democracies.  You can't force it on someone.  They have to want it, and everything that goes along with it.  They would have to decide to do it themselves, or risk losing all the things you cite as attributes of the community.

 

The best situation would be for Como residents organize, eliminate the social hazards that impact perceptions of the area, and investe in locally owned/operated businesses in the area.  They don't have to be fancy businesses.  But it's got to come from within.  They have to own their community.

 

That's my belief anyway.  BUT, if they can't do that, the community will eventually disappear a little at a time.

[Doohickie]

While I agree with everything you say, there's also that question of capital.  Where will the money come from to do all those things?  That's the problem with certain FtW neighborhoods:  They have wonderful history and a lot of potential, but they just don't draw outside capital for development.  (The same is true in the area around Wesleyan.  My son just finished there.  It's potentially such a cool area, but the only sources of capital are TWU and the city; you don't see outside concerns putting money into the area.)

[cberen1]

I agree on the capital 100%.  When I say it has to come from within, I don't mean to imply that it's easy or likely.  In fact, I think it is highly unlikely. 

 

The people who have the capacity to leave Como for better surroundings would have to decide to stay put and invest in their community in a way that most citizens do not even think about.  It would have to be a deliberate decision by neighborhood leaders within the Como community to stay instead of leave and to convince others to do the same.  It harkens back to the citizens of Fort Worth going out to finish the last leg of the rail line into town.  Hard to imagine that happening today.

 

You know, U.S. Rep. Marc Veasey grew up in Como.  What if Marc decided to keep his family in Como and invest with other upwardly mobile Comosians (oh yeah, that's a word now...) to buy up and rehabilitate run down properties bit by bit?  What if individuals who do have an interest in maintaining and enriching the Como community financially back small businesses in and around Como, run by Comosians?  A community doesn't have to be rich to thrive, but it does need local ownership of the land, the business and the community.

 

Again, I think it's very unlikely, but if Como has the civic pride and sense of community that it sounds like, then they've got a key ingredient that most disadvantaged areas do not.

[Russ Graham]

I don't see any requirement for revitalization to come "from within".  Several examples:  Does Richard Garvey live in Museum Place?  Does Ed Bass live in Sundance Square?  I'm actually not sure but the point is they don't have to.  If you look at your favorite real estate website, (Zillow, Trulia, etc) at land prices in Como, there are some deals to be had.  Anybody could in theory, buy up a cheap, foreclosed lot, and build a custom house, and they would have new housing for cheap, with excellent access to downtown, Riglea, and South West FW (via Bryant Irvin and CTP).  So that could be somebody that already lives there, or somebody from outside.  If the "sense of community" of Como requires nobody new ever to move in, then it might not survive this revitalization.  That's something that all "revitalizing" neighborhoods have to deal with.  It doesn't always benefit the existing population, especially if they are renters and not homeowners.

[Doohickie]

You know, U.S. Rep. Marc Veasey grew up in Como. 

 

Actually, I think that's where I saw some of the info about Como- Veasey's FB page.  I believe he went there for a parade... on Easter?  Or something like that.

[renamerusk]

I don't see any requirement for revitalization to come "from within".....If you look at your favorite real estate website, (Zillow, Trulia, etc) at land prices in Como, there are some deals to be had.  Anybody could in theory, buy up a cheap, foreclosed lot, and build a custom house, and they would have new housing for cheap, with excellent access to downtown, Riglea, and South West FW (via Bryant Irvin and CTP). 

 

 I agree RG.  There is really no barriers in the way of keeping South Arlington Heights from expanding westward to Horne Street.   You asked for the next area to revitalize; with little hesitation, Como must be among the top of the list.

[hannerhan]

In response to the OP, I think the White Settlement corridor between Crestwood and 183 is due. 

 

The Rivercrest Bluffs residential development is one thing happening already, and I know of several other properties that have traded within the past 2 years that are slated for major work.  Given the natural resource of the Trinity/Trinity Trails which crosses White Settlement twice, the proximity to downtown/W 7th, high end residential on either end (Crestwood/Monticello on the East and Westover/Westworth Park on the West), and the buildup of shopping to the West over the past decade (Sam's/Lowe's/Target/Wal Mart/Ridgmar Mall within 5 minutes), it just seems like the stage is set.

[cberen1]

I don't see any requirement for revitalization to come "from within".  Several examples:  Does Richard Garvey live in Museum Place?  Does Ed Bass live in Sundance Square?  I'm actually not sure but the point is they don't have to.  If you look at your favorite real estate website, (Zillow, Trulia, etc) at land prices in Como, there are some deals to be had.  Anybody could in theory, buy up a cheap, foreclosed lot, and build a custom house, and they would have new housing for cheap, with excellent access to downtown, Riglea, and South West FW (via Bryant Irvin and CTP).  So that could be somebody that already lives there, or somebody from outside.  If the "sense of community" of Como requires nobody new ever to move in, then it might not survive this revitalization.  That's something that all "revitalizing" neighborhoods have to deal with.  It doesn't always benefit the existing population, especially if they are renters and not homeowners.

 

I agree with what you're saying.  But the point was made (and I'm paraphrasing) that that kind of outside money would destroy the social fabric of the existing Como community.  Look at Linwood as an example.  Whatever has been there will no longer be there.  I think it's great for Fort Worth.  It won't be great for anyone who liked Linwood and wanted for it to remain in tact, only better.  Outside money will not be gentle with preserving all the things that current residents like.  It will do whatever makes teh most financial sense.  So if the goal is preserving the good that's there, outside money will do more harm than good.

[Volare]

While I agree with everything you say, there's also that question of capital.  Where will the money come from to do all those things?  That's the problem with certain FtW neighborhoods:  They have wonderful history and a lot of potential, but they just don't draw outside capital for development.  (The same is true in the area around Wesleyan.  My son just finished there.  It's potentially such a cool area, but the only sources of capital are TWU and the city; you don't see outside concerns putting money into the area.)

 

F&R Distilling is trying to infuse just that sort of money into east Fort Worth, and are being given quite a hard time by the locals.

 

http://www.fortworth...wtopic=5610&hl=

[johnfwd]

The large-scale project planned for Linwood is financially feasible because almost (or all) the old substandard housing will be demolished and replaced by new buildings.  And the area is close to the highly marketable West Seventh projects.  Large-scale revitalization could be done in Como but that would mean buying out residents and commercial owners in order to replace the mostly substandard buildings with new structures.   Even if Como residents were willing to move out after getting fair-market value for their homes and businesses, would the costs be financially feasible for a developer?

 

At the risk of stating the obvious, piecemeal gentrification of Como or any neighborhood is difficult largely for reasons of re-sell value and property taxation.  Largely because of low re-sell value and high property taxation,  a builder is going to be reluctant to spend money to construct a new house or two (or a new commercial building or two)  in a neighborhood consisting mostly of substandard buildings.  Not to mention the reluctance to start a project in an unmarketable area having poor infrastructure (not just bad roads, but bad water, sewer and storm drainage pipes).

[RenaissanceMan]

 Not to mention the reluctance to start a project in an unmarketable area having poor infrastructure (not just bad roads, but bad water, sewer and storm drainage pipes).

You just nailed the way that these types of neighborhood revitalization efforts (that sometimes lead to a small or large amount of gentrification) occur - begin by improving the infrastructure in the areas, especially in ways that are highly visible and engage local residents in the process. In the absence of the pioneering developer or the spontaneous availability of capital springing up from within the neighborhood, public investment can go far in producing some momentum. Oh yeah... and in the process it shows a commitment to an area that has been historically underserved.

 

The wall that was put up by Ridglea Country Club as a defense against Como and as an obstacle to the club's employees as they walk home could also be a factor in some small way.

[Doohickie]

 

While I agree with everything you say, there's also that question of capital.  Where will the money come from to do all those things?  That's the problem with certain FtW neighborhoods:  They have wonderful history and a lot of potential, but they just don't draw outside capital for development.  (The same is true in the area around Wesleyan.  My son just finished there.  It's potentially such a cool area, but the only sources of capital are TWU and the city; you don't see outside concerns putting money into the area.)

 

F&R Distilling is trying to infuse just that sort of money into east Fort Worth, and are being given quite a hard time by the locals.

 

http://www.fortworth...wtopic=5610&hl=

 

 

That's progress for ya.  Or not.

[Austin55]

I'll be interested to see the changes that Montgomery Ave. goes through here soon. It's already a pretty trafficked street with a built up area to one side and a prewar neighborhood on the other, much like Magnolia. With the NRWMC coming sometime soon I wouldn't be surprised to see a lot of business spring up along the street driven by Arlington heights residents and tourists and guests to the WRMC and nearby museums.Hopefully they can maintain an interesting character such as Hale House. 

[Russ Graham]

Hopefully they can maintain an interesting character such as Hale House. 

 

After Dennis Shingleton won his spot on the council, he did a series of community meetings.  I went to the one he held at the UNTHSC.  Somebody asked him about the future plans for Montgomery, and he specifically mentioned that he wanted to get rid of "that darn airplane"!  He seemed pretty worked up about it.

 

Personally I like it.  The Hale House building itself is interesting - it looks like it must be at most 500 sq ft, and it's all storefront glass. 

[Austin55]

What?! The airplane is one of the most recognizable places in FW. I hope it never leaves.

[Fort Worthology]

Yeah, I am baffled by the hatred some in that area have for the plane.  It's fun.

 

Heaven forbid anything on the west side have some personality beyond beige stucco and red tile roofs.

[cjyoung]

 

While I agree with everything you say, there's also that question of capital.  Where will the money come from to do all those things?  That's the problem with certain FtW neighborhoods:  They have wonderful history and a lot of potential, but they just don't draw outside capital for development.  (The same is true in the area around Wesleyan.  My son just finished there.  It's potentially such a cool area, but the only sources of capital are TWU and the city; you don't see outside concerns putting money into the area.)

 

F&R Distilling is trying to infuse just that sort of money into east Fort Worth, and are being given quite a hard time by the locals.

 

http://www.fortworth...wtopic=5610&hl=

 

It's southeast   and many of my relatives who are long-time residents of the area want investments in the area. The question is whether a distillery would improve the area which isn't that bad to begin with. Maybe not in comparison to the better parts of Arlington Heights, but there are a lot of nice homes around the golf course.

[mmiller2002]

The plane is falling apart, or at least looks like it is.  I'm surprised the owners' lawyers don't make them get rid of it...

I liked it at first, but it looks a bit crappy right now.

[mmmdan]

So, you're saying that it could use a coat of paint?

[mmiller2002]

So, you're saying that it could use a coat of paint?

falling apart too

[Volare]

It does have some structural issues because it isn’t really one airplane, it’s a mashup of a few different planes. Kinda amusing.

[johnfwd]

The FW Business Press reported yesterday the City Council approved a long-range plan to redevelop the Stop Six area, particularly Cavile Place.  A lot of the properties in this area are vacant following numerous foreclosures.  This is particularly good news for the East Rosedale neighborhoods.

[McHand]

I drove up Glen Garden to the country club yesterday just for fun.  What a gem of a neighborhood.  

I hope it gets "rediscovered" soon.  

[Austin55]

Curious to see where exactly Topgolf will go in. I'd assume somewhere near Gatewaypark/Beach St. area.  The Houston/Dallas Topgolfs are all in pretty nice, suburban areas. Usually near a big strip mall and apartment complexes. I wonder what effect the FW Topgolf will have on the neighborhood its built in?

[Voz]

Late to the party, but I'd love to see something happen in/around Como.  If I were mega-wealthy, well-connected, and politically influential then I'd have been buying property in Como for a while now too.  With the coming Clearfork, Edwards Ranch, and LMRA/Waterside developments all within a mile or two of that area, plus it's proximity to Camp Bowie and Hulen areas, there's value in that location. 

 

Right now, empty lots sell at rates equivalent to $50k/acre.  Houses with the same lot size vary in price, but you'd be spending $350k-$400K an acre if you bought the land with houses on it.  Super duper rough calculations on my part put the acreage in Como at 320 (give or take oodles).  Assuming every acre averaged $400k, you're looking at a price tag of $128 million.

 

I wish I knew what Trademark paid for the 63 acres it bought of the LMRA for some context.

[Austin55]

Curious how the East 4th street area will be in the coming years,. If the Top Golf goes with this location it'd could be a big springboard. The area has great access to downtown and the upcoming RAD area, directly on multiple highways, and has the river as its anchor, and the Trinity has been a hot place to develop around lately. The East side already has Martin House as an anchor, but the west side is almost completely undeveloped. The biggest issue for the west side is that it is trapped on 2 sides by large highways, and there are 3 gas pads within the area. 

 

[Doohickie]

The slightly frustrating thing for me in that part of town (let's call it the near east side) is that it is very fragmented, at least in my mind.  West of I-35W, there are basically four areas:  Downtown, Uptown, Northside (incl. Stockyards) and the rather sprawling Southside.  Even though the river flows through and there are some major highways, things aren't too chopped up and there are relatively large contiguous areas.

 

On the Near East Side there are two additional limited access roads to segment things (287 & 121), larger parks (Sycamore/Cobb, Gateway and the whole Trinity Basin along Randol Mill, and the river in general seems more disruptive to neighborhoods.  I like the concept of east side development, but it just seems kind of intimidating to outsiders in terms of accidentally ending up in the "wrong area" considering it's levels of economic diversity.

 

Still, I think Riverside Arts District (RAD) and Meadowbrook are poised for rejuvenation considering the amount of affordable, historically significant housing.  I can see a rebirth in RAD driving further growth in adjoining areas, similar to how Fairmount has been a trailblazer for southside development.

 

One last thought:  I could see development of the Near Southside jumping I-35W and spreading east along Vickery and Rosedale.  Main Street Village is really just a few blocks from I-35 and I can see where South Main Village (SMV) will be an even bigger renaissance than Magnolia/Fairmount, once it gets rolling.  In 5 years I think SMV will be looking like a mix of W7th and Oak Cliff.  It will be a desirable area to visit for a night out, and will have expensive housing there as well as north, south and west of there.  But just east of there affordable for a while, and if people want to be bicycle close to Downtown, Magnolia, and SMV, the Historic Southside east of I-35W may become the place to be.

 

EDIT:  Clarified acronyms... see italics.

[RD Milhollin]

I must have blinked... What are RAD and SMV?

[Austin55]

^

RAD-Riverside Arts District (The area around Race street) 

 

He put SMV and MSV, but I think he means SMV-South Main Village.

 

@Doohickie- I'd love to see some urban development along the redone Evan's avenue, that streetscape is just to nice to go to waste. It would be cool to see a walkable area like that keep its roots to. 

[Doohickie]

I must have blinked... What are RAD and SMV?

 

Sorry, I spelled them out for future posterity. 

[Doohickie]

@Doohickie- I'd love to see some urban development along the redone Evan's avenue, that streetscape is just to nice to go to waste. It would be cool to see a walkable area like that keep its roots to. 

 

Yes, it does look nice.  One advantage that Fairmount has to the west is it is less hilly (better for cycling).  Evans kind of has some rolling inclines along its length.

[RD Milhollin]

Curious how the East 4th street area will be in the coming years,. If the Top Golf goes with this location it'd could be a big springboard. The area has great access to downtown and the upcoming RAD area, directly on multiple highways, and has the river as its anchor, and the Trinity has been a hot place to develop around lately. The East side already has Martin House as an anchor, but the west side is almost completely undeveloped. The biggest issue for the west side is that it is trapped on 2 sides by large highways, and there are 3 gas pads within the area. 

 

 

The gas pads are (or should be) deal breakers for any sort of development that involves concentrating large numbers of people together in one place. No one who is educated as to the explosive and toxic potential of well sites is going to choose to live near one of these places, and similarly dense office environments are not practical; what sort of company would intentionally put valuable, highly productive employees in harm's way? These well sites are off limits themselves, period; you can't build on top of them because of the potential for poisonous leaks even after they are "sealed". That said, the legislature seems to be trying to soften up any local restrictions that can be placed on drilling, drilling sites, and use of adjacent areas, so perhaps medium-density low-cost housing will be "practical" given the depressed value of land surrounding these operations, but as best I can see light industrial use is probably the best overall use of these properties.

[Doohickie]

what sort of company would intentionally put valuable, highly productive employees in harm's way?

What sort of harm do you envision? Can you provide any examples of these hazards actually hurting people? (Not trolling; I'm serious.)

[RD Milhollin]

 

... explosive and toxic potential of well sites... potential for poisonous leaks even after they are "sealed". 

 

 

Companies and other large organizations often have rules in place preventing several key employees from traveling together on the same flight. It is not just those companies who have previously lost groups of executives or specialists in such a way, that sort of policy is based on the (admittedly low) probability of such an event taking place and the cost of the loss to the organization.  

[ruthannbeloved]

My husband & I talk about this a lot lately (Como Revival). The location of Como is so good, it's inevitable that it will be a place that will see revitalization in the (near?) future. We've thought about buying up land, or even finding something we like and building a cool house there. 

[McHand]

You'd better get it quick, ruthann, because Como prices are rising quickly.

[BlueMound]

Como Revival might deserve its own thread.

[Austin55]

Upper West Side might be interesting soon. It reminds me a lot of Southside a few years ago, it's got a fairly large job concentration in a semi-urban layout, a smattering of historic structures throughtout, there's a decent stock of apartments that are somewhat urban, It's got large and uninterrupted access to downtown (unlike NSS with 30/trains) and is across the river from West 7th. 

 

The area right now lacks character. It's just not really interesting. Retail and restaurant options are a 7-11, a suburban style CVS and a Taco Bell. UWS is just kinda "there". 

 

If the Pier 1 apartments and ACH campus apartments happen, there is suddenly 600+ more units in the neighborhood. Perhaps there will be a bit of a spark from these developments to add some interest to UWS. 

[Mr_Brightside526]

In response to the OP, I think the White Settlement corridor between Crestwood and 183 is due. 

 

The Rivercrest Bluffs residential development is one thing happening already, and I know of several other properties that have traded within the past 2 years that are slated for major work.  Given the natural resource of the Trinity/Trinity Trails which crosses White Settlement twice, the proximity to downtown/W 7th, high end residential on either end (Crestwood/Monticello on the East and Westover/Westworth Park on the West), and the buildup of shopping to the West over the past decade (Sam's/Lowe's/Target/Wal Mart/Ridgmar Mall within 5 minutes), it just seems like the stage is set.

 

I agree completely. I was scanning this thread to see if anyone had mentioned this area. River Park is soon to be the next neighborhood to turn but it will turn differently than neighborhoods like Linwood because the lots are so much larger and heavily wooded. I predict it will be a great neighborhood for custom home builders with clientele that want to be close to downtown and the W 7th/Cultural District. 

 

The new Crystal Springs on the River project will help this momentum too.

[Austin55]

The White Settlement area is going up big time for sure, it seems as if it's gotten it's own name now - River District. 

[hannerhan]

 

In response to the OP, I think the White Settlement corridor between Crestwood and 183 is due. 

 

The Rivercrest Bluffs residential development is one thing happening already, and I know of several other properties that have traded within the past 2 years that are slated for major work.  Given the natural resource of the Trinity/Trinity Trails which crosses White Settlement twice, the proximity to downtown/W 7th, high end residential on either end (Crestwood/Monticello on the East and Westover/Westworth Park on the West), and the buildup of shopping to the West over the past decade (Sam's/Lowe's/Target/Wal Mart/Ridgmar Mall within 5 minutes), it just seems like the stage is set.

 

I agree completely. I was scanning this thread to see if anyone had mentioned this area. River Park is soon to be the next neighborhood to turn but it will turn differently than neighborhoods like Linwood because the lots are so much larger and heavily wooded. I predict it will be a great neighborhood for custom home builders with clientele that want to be close to downtown and the W 7th/Cultural District. 

 

The new Crystal Springs on the River project will help this momentum too.

 

 

Momentum in this area is accelerating.  Some big investors have been buying up lots in the river bend south of White Settlement, and based off a quick scan of TAD I'd say that more than half that entire neighborhood has already turned over.  Construction fences around Crystal Springs and a couple of other locations within the past week.  HGC gutting a building for their new HQ right on White Settlement.  Soon the whole area will be a big construction zone...will be fun to watch.