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Amazon in search of 2nd headquarters


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#51 Now in Denton

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 11:46 AM

I was a minority just a few weeks ago when I suggested that TRV have a couple of skyscrapers "to bookend"  DT and TRV. Now people are open to a "variance" ? lol And another point I made about building a skyscraper on the Westchester site I was a minority on that one also.  If people want a Amazon HQ in downtown Fort Worth. Thinking outside of the box to land Amazon will be key. 

 

I been hearing a lot of numbers and comparisons thrown about on what Amazon wants 300 to 100 acres. It would take eight Burnet Plazas. And that is not even talking about Amazon employees living in DT. Well no point is discussing this any further. Because Dallas won it already...well according to Dallas Urban members lol. I suggest you look at one of renderings they have for DT Dallas Amazon HQ. I must say looks pretty cool looking.

 

Then we have Ross Perot Jr. If Fort Worth pushed for a Amazon HQ in Alliance I think Perot would back Fort Worth. But if Fort Worth wants a DT Fort Worth HQ. I think Perot would back DT Dallas. If that is the case. We really need Mr. Bass to help push a DT HQ. And if that is not enough every major city in the U.S. and Canada wants to land this. Interesting times ahead.



#52 Volare

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 11:58 AM

Well who is to say that PI isn't just an ETJ for "Dallas"?



#53 renamerusk

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 12:01 PM

.... (1) I been hearing a lot of numbers and comparisons thrown about on what Amazon wants 300 to 100 acres. It would take eight Burnet Plazas.....

 

(2) Then we have Ross Perot Jr. If Fort Worth pushed for a Amazon HQ in Alliance I think Perot would back Fort Worth. But if Fort Worth wants a DT Fort Worth HQ. I think Perot would back DT Dallas. If that is the case. We really need Mr. Bass to help push a DT HQ. .....

 

1. I think that you could easily fit 8 Burnett Plazas upon the 800 acre P.I. with room to spare.

 

2. Neither Ross Perot, Jr. or Mr. Bass will be able IMO to persuade Jeff Bezos who I believe is now one if not the richest man in the world. Perot will always concentrate his office project in Uptown as demonstrated by his speculative tower of which he has yet to be successful in getting a major tenant.  Mr. Bass would prefer to champion Sundance Square above other parts of the City.

 

The one person for whom Fort Worth can be certain of and who will put P.I. into Mr. Bezos' in-box is Representative Kay Granger. 



#54 Volare

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 12:06 PM

The one person for whom Fort Worth can be certain of and who will put P.I. into Mr. Bezos' in-box is Representative Kay Granger. 

 

 

Based on who the manager of PI is, I think you are right.

 

It is unfortunate that due to such nepotism this project has been needlessly hamstrung and delayed for so long. Professional management along with public approval for such a massive public spending project would have done wonders for the support and momentum of PI. 

 

I've long thought that the high restrictions proposed for PI were very small time thinking. Perhaps Amazon and the buildings required  would be a way to shatter these restrictions.



#55 renamerusk

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 12:33 PM

If Dallas had only known, today it might have had a plot of land such as Center Port to bid for an Amazon:

 

DFW Airport opens and Love Field shuts down - With the drastic reduction in flights and only 467,212 enplanements in 1975,Love Field decommissioned several of its concourses. The city of Dallas attempted to make use of these dormant facilities by leasing some of them to an entrepreneur who opened the "Love Entertainment Complex" in November 1975. The main lobby at the front of a former terminal was transformed into movie theaters, ice rink, roller rink, huge video arcades, restaurants and bowling alley. Love seemed especially suited for the pre-teen and teen crowd, who could spend the day for a single admission charge of about $3.50. Love closed in May 1978.[ Several of the concourses were remodeled into support and training buildings for Southwest Airlines....Eventually, SWA was born.

 

As the saying goes "A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".



#56 RD Milhollin

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 12:54 PM

Some reasons that the Panther Island site might suit the criteria Amazon is looking for in a location for their HQ2:

 

 

  • Metropolitan areas with more than one million people:

Fort Worth is rapidly approaching the 1M population mark itself, the surrounding MSA including Dallas has more than 7M, and the Ft Worth/Arlington Metro Census Division has about 2.4M. The DFW Metro area is the 4th most populous in the country.

 

  • A stable and business-friendly environment:

The area is well-known for attracting out-of-state businesses. Dallas is ahead of the curve in this department but Fort Worth has retained Lockheed Martin, Bell Helicopter, Alcon, BNSF and AA for many years. No state income taxes and an affordable cost-of-living would probably appeal to many of the employees who would relocate here.

 

  • Urban or suburban locations with the potential to attract and retain strong technical talent:

Hmm, what is this talent pool likely to be attracted to? Education? TCU, UTA, UNT, TWU, Texas Wesleyan, TCC, UTA-FW, Tarleton-FW... Arts? FW Art Museums, Cowboy/Cowgirl, Cliburn competition, Symphony Orchestra, Opera season, Art and Music Festivals, Marathon and mudding events...  Sports: Cowboys, Rangers, Hockey and B-Ball over in Dallas 30 miles away, motor racing, Colonial Golf tournament, Horned Frogs, Vaqueros soccer, and the possibility of a minor league Baseball team right in the middle of the mix, stadium already in place. Theater? Lots of traditional and avant-garde options close by including Casa Mañana, Bass Hall, Stage West, Circle, Jubilee, Amphibian. Hangouts? Stockyards, West 7th, New Southside, Downtown, and probably a whole new area in and around Panther Island. Recreation? Forest-Trinity, Gateway Parks, New state parks west of town and the LBJ Grasslands to the north, Trinity Trails, Trinity River canoeing/kayaking, several large area lakes. Climate... well it is different than Seattle... Except for blazing heat in the middle of summer it is really not too bad. Some rain but plenty of sunshine. Mild winters on the average, nice Spring and Autumn, and who knows, maybe the Summer we are just finishing up is the new normal. I would guess that the architects for Amazon would assure that trees, accommodations for structural shade and breeze, and other climate-mitigating aspects would be built into their designs. Living right next to urban water features should be nice for the employees and residents, but it would of course not be a direct substitute for Lake Washington... 

 

  • Communities that think big and creatively when considering locations and real estate options:

Is there any larger scale US publicly-directed urban real estate redevelopment currently in the works than the Panther Island project? From the beginning this was pretty audacious, many if not most residents didn't think it would ever see fruition. What was once a decrepit former industrial area with serious environmental concerns is being developed into a unique urban neighborhood... and the final word on what it could be is still very much subject to negotiation. Much of the infrastructure that a relocating company would ask for in initial negotiations is already underway (bridges, streets, utilities) and this is an ideal time in the project timeline for other options that a potential client like Amazon might prefer to be incorporated into the plan. Historically Fort Worth has planned big, ref. Air Force Plant 4, Greater Southwest/Amon Carter Airport, and later DFW Airport. 

 

HQ2 could be, but does not have to be:

  • An urban or downtown campus:

At this point if Amazon opted in they could build out Panther Island to suit what they envision as an ideal Work/Live/Play (oops, sorry) environment best suited for their business needs and the needs of their employees. This is probably where the transportation needs enter into the equation. A streetcar line bisecting the island and connecting it to the Downtown ITC and the Stockyards TEXRail station would assure quick access to DFW airport. DFW is a huge selling point for any corporate relocation as there are non-stop flights to almost anywhere in the US, and an increasing number of foreign destinations, especially in Asia. Not to be forgotten is the option of corporate aviation services at nearby Meacham Airport; If Amazon were to build here I could see that as possibly the necessary tipping-point for a commercial carrier to consider scheduled service to places like LGA, DCA, LAX, oh, and SEA from FTW. This relocation could also be the kick-in-the-pants that would get Fort Worth Transit to initiate commuter train service from Downtown up to the Alliance Corridor; Alliance Airport/multimodal facilities, and existing Amazon installations. Depending on how they were to structure their incentives there might end up being a "reverse" commuter pattern from housing in Panther Island to the fulfillment centers around Alliance.

 

  • A similar layout to Amazon’s Seattle campus:

See above; if Amazon leadership believes that the layout/configuration/composition of their current campus is ideal for their needs they could recreate it on the Island. Alternatively, they could incorporate the best if what they currently have with the best of the environment presented by Panther Island.

 

  • A development-prepped site. We want to encourage states and communities to think creatively for viable real estate options, while not negatively affecting our preferred timeline.

This site just adjacent to downtown Fort Worth would probably be about as turn-key for new development as anywhere they could find that fits their size criteria. Things on the Island have been seemingly dragging along for years now because of the necessity of simultaneously pursuing federal funding every two years while scheduling the spending to acquire, clear, remediate, and replat properties and constructing the new infrastructure called for. It has been a balancing act making sure the resources are there for the development phase being worked on. With a major client like Amazon willing to take up the majority of the developable land on the site I bet work could jackrabbit forward with new private-sector financing secured by a new-found certainty of successful completion; i.e. less speculation. There are also state and COG/Transportation funds that could be accessed to put infrastructure projects on an accelerated track. Panther Island is probably the closest thing Amazon is going to find in terms of a clean slate, prepped and ready to roll for what they envision.

 

That said, Fort Worth should not participate with Dallas in a regional effort; this approach almost always results in these projects ending up in Dallas or Collin Counties, or in Arlington for that matter. I can see a Dallas-Regional bid centering on the Texas Stadium site in Irving... Even the earthquakes there could help to make the Seattle-transplants feel at home. If Amazon expresses interest in the Panther Island option the City, County, COG, and other interested entities (cultural, educational, technical, complementary business) should be prepared to address any anticipated concern that could be brought up during initial negotiations. This is an opportunity that Fort Worth should pursue enthusiastically as there seems to be an excellent match here between what Amazon says they want and what the city has to offer. 



#57 renamerusk

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 01:19 PM

RDM, great expose.

 

The feeling among Dallasites is that it should not be in the suburbs (Plano,Frisco,Irving,etc.) but squarely with the core of Dallas. Dallas will no more support a non-Dallas location than it will support a Fort Worth location. Recall how chafed Mayor Rawlings  felt when complainedt that Dallas was not given a real shot at either Toyota or State Farms.  Today, there is a real distaste in Dallas City Hall for Collins County.



#58 Now in Denton

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 02:39 PM

https://t.co/1EFFKbAEA3

 

Fort Worth Business Press



#59 rriojas71

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 03:57 PM

We need to keep pushing for a "Amazon to Panther Island" movement... and the city needs to get involved. Panther Island already has a circulator planned which will help with Amazon's mass transit need. Also, the possibility of a central rail line that can use the alternate route Tex Rail had that would have stops in the TCU area, Medical District, West 7th, North Panther Island (near Ellis Pecan bldg) and terminate at the 28th street station to transfer to the airport would go a long way with attracting Amazon or any potential companies.

This would be a game changer for FW.

#60 Austin55

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 04:06 PM

For me, it's weird to think about PI being a good site for Amazon since it's seems that it has always been planned as mostly a dense, lowrise filled primarily residential area. It would take a big change of those plans for Amazon (or any other major corp) to establish there. I feel downtown proper is better suited in almost every way, with the exception of space being a non issue in PI.

 

Here's my bold suggestion. Do something Similar to Hudson Yards in NYC or Schuylkill Yards in Philadelphia and build a massive complex on top of the rail yards on the east side of downtown between 35 and the ITC.



#61 renamerusk

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 05:29 PM

(1) ..... it  [P.I.] has always been planned as mostly a dense, lowrise filled primarily residential area. 

 

(2) ....downtown proper is better suited in almost every way, with the exception of space being a non issue in PI.  Here's my bold suggestion. Do something Similar to Hudson Yards in NYC or Schuylkill Yards in Philadelphia and build a massive complex on top of the rail yards on the east side of downtown between 35 and the ITC.

 

 1. Plans can be changed.  A long tested truism is "the only constant thing is change itself".  Deciding to withhold an offer of P.I. to Amazon solely to adhere to a superficial building heights plan would be an incredibly boneheaded act of intransigence.

 

 2. As a suggestion, it would be irrelevant in this instant because the rail yards in Fort Worth are still active; they are not for sale; and they are not in anyway or fashion ready for development.



#62 Austin55

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 05:33 PM

Both yards in my suggestion are still active as well. The developments are built above the tracks.

#63 Now in Denton

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 06:12 PM

Me personally. I will support a Amazon HQ in the TRV. Only if skyscrapers are allowed on the nothern end. But I still want low rise and even open space on the southern half of TRV.  Plus I think Amazon wants skyscrapers in its plans. And widening the downtown business district for high rise residential. Again it looks like that is what Amazon wants also for its employees. 



#64 renamerusk

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 07:58 PM

Both yards in my suggestion are still active as well. The developments are built above the tracks.

 

I stand corrected. :rolleyes:



#65 renamerusk

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 08:06 PM

Me personally. I will support a Amazon HQ in the TRV. Only if skyscrapers are allowed on the nothern end. But I still want low rise and even open space on the southern half of TRV.  Plus I think Amazon wants skyscrapers in its plans. And widening the downtown business district for high rise residential. Again it looks like that is what Amazon wants also for its employees. 

 

 I'm puzzled...why low rises? Isn't it the market that determines the size of buildings?  When regulations or personal preferences intervene in the real estate market, you get developers who shy away. Is there a "view" that you are seeking to preserve?



#66 Jeriat

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 08:28 PM

I could actually see them having about 3 or 4 ten-story buildings in the Near Southside... 

But I'd still rather see a skyscraper in downtown. 


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#67 renamerusk

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 08:38 PM

I could actually see them having about 3 or 4 ten-story buildings in the Near Southside... But I'd still rather see a skyscraper in downtown. 

 

 3 or 4 10-story where...the land, the NS, where?



#68 PeopleAreStrange

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 09:58 PM

I could actually see them having about 3 or 4 ten-story buildings in the Near Southside... 

But I'd still rather see a skyscraper in downtown. 

 

Try 3 or 4 thirty-seven story buildings! That would be too much for the Near Southside in my opinion.


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#69 Jeriat

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 10:02 PM

 

I could actually see them having about 3 or 4 ten-story buildings in the Near Southside... But I'd still rather see a skyscraper in downtown. 

 

 3 or 4 10-story where...the land, the NS, where?

 

 

Was thinking near 30. But just a thought. 


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#70 PeopleAreStrange

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 10:11 PM

I'm still thinking downtown is the best location. With Panther Island, you've got to pass through either downtown or the north side to access it.


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#71 Now in Denton

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 10:23 PM

 

Me personally. I will support a Amazon HQ in the TRV. Only if skyscrapers are allowed on the nothern end. But I still want low rise and even open space on the southern half of TRV.  Plus I think Amazon wants skyscrapers in its plans. And widening the downtown business district for high rise residential. Again it looks like that is what Amazon wants also for its employees. 

 

 I'm puzzled...why low rises? Isn't it the market that determines the size of buildings?  When regulations or personal preferences intervene in the real estate market, you get developers who shy away. Is there a "view" that you are seeking to preserve?

 

I'm puzzled why no one liked my idea about building a couple of towers on TRV a few weeks ago ? If my idea was bad a few weeks ago ? Then it should still be a bad idea now ? Now that Amazon is looking for a HQ. And some are wanting Amazon in TRV. Fact. Amazon don't want a Radio Shack or Toyota type campus. TRV has height restrictions. So you see the conflict ? 

 

Trinity RIVER Vision. TRV is about the urban lake. And TRV is suppose to have a River Walk three four times bigger tha n San Antonio's. You would lose all that "view" if the whole of TRV is full of 30 40 50 story skyscrapers. Then what is the point of have a River Walk and Urban Lake if it is over shadowed by tall buildings ? Might as well start building now as is. Plus I think it is a selling point that Amazon employees could enjoy the open space of a Urban Lake. And a River Walk.  San Antonio's River Walk is surrounded by buildings at the right height and not overpowered by tall buildings. 

 

In fact over at the Dallas forum. Someone made a rendering of Amazon HQ in DT Dallas. And they put the Amazon HQ tall buildings surrounding a open space in there Trinity River Park project. I don't want to steal the picture. But its very cool looking I must say. I suggest go check it out. 



#72 Now in Denton

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 10:27 PM

I'm still thinking downtown is the best location. With Panther Island, you've got to pass through either downtown or the north side to access it.

 

I am open to that idea also. But where would you put it ? Knowing the amount of office space they want ? And its employees to live nearby ? 



#73 rriojas71

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 11:26 PM

I was biking in Trinity Park today and I thought what about all that vacant and unused land north of the intersection of Forest Park and I-30. On the eastern bank across from Trinity Park and west of Forest Park Blvd. That area is under the Downtown District so it could have high rises of any height. There is a rail line that cuts across FP Blvd and it's right off of the Freeway.

Downtown, W7th, Cultural District, TCU, UNTHSC, Dickies Arena, The Zoo, The Near SS, Medical District... are all easily accessible from this area by foot, bike, car & kayak... lol

Edit. Residential could be east of Forest Park and towards Midtown and Sunset Terrace

#74 renamerusk

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Posted 10 September 2017 - 10:42 AM

Fort Worth, county, state and federal and we as taxpayers already have spent  millions of dollars for improvement and flood control in the Trinity River Basin and one of its signature project, theTRV, is nearing the take-off stage.   Now an opportunity, Amazon,  may come our way to cash in on that investment and instead of seeing it as the City's headmost site in all of Fort Worth, places that are and remain 7-days ago completely unprepared or unavailable are being suggested as though they are comparable to P.I. 

 

Fort Worth, to become a finalist, must submit its best offer and not its best wish list.  Dallas has a wish list, its called the conceptual Trinity River Central Park while Fort Worth has the actual ground turning, concrete pouring, road laying, bridge building, utility setting.  There are some very big time hitters (NYC,Bos, Chi,Dal) making presumably their best pitch; don't you believe that Fort Worth should do the same?

 

Meanwhile in Texas, Fort Worth's competition may be described as frantic and realistically serious -

 

 Dallas - frantic because of its Trinity River Waterfront not even approved, started or being ready; considering demolishing Historic Fair Park or taking over private property from individuals and businesses with the Deep Ellum and Cedars neighborhoods; and now scrambling to identify available land sites.

 

 Austin - realistically serious but with some problems -https://communityimp...pment-in-limbo/



#75 Doohickie

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 03:28 PM

Work/Live/Play (oops, sorry)

 

No, you're okay.  You used slashes.  The discouraged format uses periods:  Work.  Live.  Play.


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#76 Doohickie

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 03:47 PM

 

 

I could actually see them having about 3 or 4 ten-story buildings in the Near Southside... But I'd still rather see a skyscraper in downtown. 

 

 3 or 4 10-story where...the land, the NS, where?

 

 

Was thinking near 30. But just a thought. 

 

 

But then we'd need to move I-30 even further south, to get the skyscrapers into downtown.


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#77 rriojas71

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 05:26 PM

A good location downtown could be those parking lots all along the SE quadrant next to the ITC. Also a though would be all the vacant land just east of the ITC. Amazon's need to be near transit & rail would be solved.

#78 renamerusk

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 06:48 PM

A good location downtown could be those parking lots all along the SE quadrant next to the ITC. Also a though would be all the vacant land just east of the ITC. Amazon's need to be near transit & rail would be solved.

 

Amazon envisions a campus as near to self containing as possible.  Amazon does not need to be near transit; it would like to be in a city that is environmentally conscientious: biking, parks, walkable etc.

 

 Does anyone know if the parking lots along the ITC are available?  Many suggestions are being made about sites whose availability is unknown.   There is probably no harm to make these suggestions other than in their current state, they are inconsequential.



#79 PeopleAreStrange

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 09:16 PM

There are 10 consecutive blocks of surface parking along Jones & Calhoun streets between 7th and 17th streets (counting the half lot). You can expand the consecutive block count to 13 if you add two blocks north and one block south. Granted, the surface lots have various different owners, but that's a lot of urban real estate if Amazon can acquire it all.

 

Amazon stated they would like to be near a rail line, and downtown Fort Worth is arguably the most walkable neighborhood in all of northern Texas.


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#80 renamerusk

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 09:45 PM

 

I'm still thinking downtown is the best location. With Panther Island, you've got to pass through either downtown or the north side to access it.

 

I am open to that idea also. But where would you put it ? Knowing the amount of office space they want ? And its employees to live nearby ?

 

 Amazon is not seeking to lease existing office buildings; it plans to invest $5B to build the new offices that it will use.  Available land, and acres of it is what is needed to construct a campus from ground upwards.

 

We could put together land almost anywhere, but that will make us just another bidder for Amazon. What is uniquely different about Fort Worth is P.I. Is there any city with this amount of land available and nearing fruition in its Downtown Core?



#81 Doohickie

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:06 AM

What is uniquely different about Fort Worth is P.I. Is there any city with this amount of land available and nearing fruition in its Downtown Core?


I don't think it's all that unique.  Detroit has been converting land in the inner core to farmland.  They have a lot of empty space.

 

It's been suggested that Buffalo use its old train station as the centerpiece of their bid.  It's currently a depressed area where land could be scooped up cheap.

centralz-1260x800.jpg

 

Another Buffalo option is brownfield land that has just been remediated in Lackawanna, just south of Buffalo (and very close to downtown, in much the way way P.I. is close to DTFW). The county has just taken ownership of the land and is seeking to redevelop it.  Buffalo and Detroit both have the benefit of seed money:  When the original owner of the Buffalo BIlls (who lived in Detroit) died, his widow split the proceeds of the sale of the team between the two cities and set up a redevelopment fund for each to the tune of ~$700 million each.  Additionally, there's the Buffalo Billion, a reinvestment fund from New York State, part of which was used to bring the Solar City plant to Buffalo.

 

I'm quite sure that if you looked at other upper midwest rust belt cities you'd find similar stories in a lot of them, at least in terms of land available near the downtown core.

 

This doesn't mean that one of those cities has an advantage over Ft Worth, but we can't kid ourselves into thinking we have some unique situation here in Fort Worth.


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#82 hannerhan

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:35 AM

Buffalo and cities like it have no chance.  In fact, Buffalo doesn't even meet Amazon's stated requirements (direct air service to Seattle), much less the implied requirements. 

 

The employee base and transportation logistics matter far more than having a cool space for a HQ building/buildings.  You can take any metro area less than 2 million people off the list, and that number is likely more like 4 million.  Just think about the real-world requirements involved in hiring 50,000 people for a specific region, in terms of both housing and the workforce itself.  There have been several good articles over the last few days about this, but you basically end up with only a small number of cities that could handle it (Denver, DFW, Atlanta, Chicago, D.C., Boston, etc.). 

 

The knock that ousted DFW in the NY Times article's predictive scenario was the lack of mass transportation, but I actually think that's unfair given the DART footprint, TexRail, etc.  But one last point: does anyone really think Jeff Bezos is worried about how great a region's train system is, when we're on the brink of having autonomous cars on the road?  I believe they're going to be a lot more focused on cost of living, a region's ability to absorb this many high paying jobs, location far enough from Seattle (ie not Portland, California, Denver), and a fantastic airport. 

 

I actually think DFW stands a great chance.  What I'd like to see is a joint bid where the region's leaders (Dallas Mayor, FW Mayor, DFW Airport CEO, etc.) pitch multiple options for Amazon: downtown/uptown Dallas, Plano/Frisco, Southlake/Westlake, and downtown FW.  Let them determine what they want.



#83 JBB

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:44 AM

This piece is insanely cynical and the title is a little harsh, but I think it raises a good point that I've thought since this story first came out: all of the requirements that Amazon has laid out are great, but in the end, it will come down to who offers them the best incentive package. Those tangible requirements are all something that they can find out on their own without the beauty pageant exercise.

http://splinternews....hell-1802701693

#84 Doohickie

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:45 AM

Buffalo and cities like it have no chance.  In fact, Buffalo doesn't even meet Amazon's stated requirements (direct air service to Seattle), much less the implied requirements.

 

Just like we're projecting ahead in terms of rail transit, I'm quite sure that if demand was there for direct flights between Buffalo and Seattle, that demand would be filled.

 

No city has a perfect portfolio.  Each will try to maximize the importance of their advantages and minimize they're weaknesses.

 

I agree that Ft Worth has a good shot at landing Amazon, but that probability is probably something like 10% right now, with probably a dozen or more cities all interested in bringing Amazon in.


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#85 Doohickie

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:47 AM

This piece is insanely cynical and the title is a little harsh, but I think it raises a good point that I've thought since this story first came out: all of the requirements that Amazon has laid out are great, but in the end, it will come down to who offers them the best incentive package.

http://splinternews....hell-1802701693

 

If that's true, you have to win the state first:  You need to convince the governor that his discretionary fund for promoting business would best be spent in Ft Worth.

 

Okay, I read the essay.  And while there is a kernel of truth in there, that's pretty much the way the world works.  The author wants some kind of utopic fantasy but business is business.


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#86 AndyN

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 01:47 PM

Sorry for the double post, but rename asked about TRV funding.  I've gone back and read posts from last year and I'm unclear on where the funding stands. It sounds like it's been approved as part of one bill and appropriated in another omnibus spending bill.  After both bills were approved, there was mention that there was no guarantee the Corps passes up backlogged projects to fund TRV and that the money could disappear in future funding cuts.  My point was that funding still may be in limbo and I was concerned that the funding and construction timeline may not match up with Amazon's wants or needs.  More of a question than a statement.

 

I don't recall all the mechanics of the arrangement, but PI is full speed ahead regardless of funding. Tarrant Regional Water District has massive financial resources (why do you think the west side gang fought so hard to keep control?) and has been paying the bills for PI in anticipation of being repaid when federal funds and/or TIF money is available. I believe the majority of the delays are over now and we won't see any issues like with the bridge construction. At least I hope not.

 

As for transportation, the PI folks are actively planning for a transit line. Wouldn't take much to extend it to 9th and Jones Intermodal Station.

 

I think PI is a great suggestion for Amazon. Housing, office and amazing lifestyle all in a central location. I hope the CofC, the Mayor, and JD Granger get together with a knock it out of the ballpark proposal.


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#87 renamerusk

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 08:42 PM

(1).....Just think about the real-world requirements involved in hiring 50,000 people for a specific region, in terms of both housing and the workforce itself.....

 

(2) ....I actually think DFW stands a great chance.  What I'd like to see is a joint bid where the region's leaders (Dallas Mayor, FW Mayor, DFW Airport CEO, etc.) pitch multiple options for Amazon: downtown/uptown Dallas, Plano/Frisco, Southlake/Westlake, and downtown FW.  Let them determine what they want.

 

 

(3) ....I don't recall all the mechanics of the arrangement, but PI is full speed ahead regardless of funding. Tarrant Regional Water District has massive financial resources (why do you think the west side gang fought so hard to keep control?) and has been paying the bills for PI in anticipation of being repaid when federal funds and/or TIF money is available. I believe the majority of the delays are over now and we won't see any issues like with the bridge construction. At least I hope not....As for transportation, the PI folks are actively planning for a transit line. Wouldn't take much to extend it to 9th and Jones Intermodal Station.

 

(4) ...I think PI is a great suggestion for Amazon. Housing, office and amazing lifestyle all in a central location. I hope the CofC, the Mayor, and JD Granger get together with a knock it out of the ballpark proposal.

 

1.  This is not or will ever be difficult for any city that gets Amazon.  When Lockheed Martin announced that it was hiring 2k new employees, applicants came to the Fort Worth Convention Center from all of the country.  When Amazon selects the location of its 2nd Hqrs,  applicants will come from all of the world.  Housing will be built to meet any demand that is created.

 

2. DFW is not a city; it is a marketing brand.  Fort Worth is a city.  When State Farms and Toyota chose locations in Collins, Fort Worth and Dallas were losers.  The prosperity of Collins County does not equate to prosperity for Tarrant County or Fort Worth.  Fort Worth = Dallas, Dallas = Fort Worth, Suburbs = Fort
Worth is poppycock.

 

3. Sometimes lady luck smiles upon you.  After years of on and off, damning and praising, P.I. is on the brink to being one if but few large parcels of land ready for development in the downtown core of a major city. AN has put to rest any doubt that it is on and and "right on time".

 

4. AN preaching to the choir.  Its malpractice on the parts of the CC, Mayor and Congresswoman  if P.I. is not the offer that FORT WORTH, TEXAS puts in the basket.

 

Why? Take a look and see what AH1 is like and how it will be replicated at AH2.

 

   https://www.amazon.c...4kc8ovgnyf996yn



#88 renamerusk

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 08:48 PM

Amazon started a debate about Fort Worth.  Two opinions seem to be predominantly held: to use P.I. or to use anything other than P.I.   The questions that interests me the most are: What to do with P.I. and the City's investment in it when Amazon chooses another city;  Does the City offer incentives to attract a corporation and residential development to P.I.;  Will P.I. attract businesses and residential development on its own?



#89 hannerhan

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 10:35 AM

 

(1).....Just think about the real-world requirements involved in hiring 50,000 people for a specific region, in terms of both housing and the workforce itself.....

 

(2) ....I actually think DFW stands a great chance.  What I'd like to see is a joint bid where the region's leaders (Dallas Mayor, FW Mayor, DFW Airport CEO, etc.) pitch multiple options for Amazon: downtown/uptown Dallas, Plano/Frisco, Southlake/Westlake, and downtown FW.  Let them determine what they want.

 

 

(3) ....I don't recall all the mechanics of the arrangement, but PI is full speed ahead regardless of funding. Tarrant Regional Water District has massive financial resources (why do you think the west side gang fought so hard to keep control?) and has been paying the bills for PI in anticipation of being repaid when federal funds and/or TIF money is available. I believe the majority of the delays are over now and we won't see any issues like with the bridge construction. At least I hope not....As for transportation, the PI folks are actively planning for a transit line. Wouldn't take much to extend it to 9th and Jones Intermodal Station.

 

(4) ...I think PI is a great suggestion for Amazon. Housing, office and amazing lifestyle all in a central location. I hope the CofC, the Mayor, and JD Granger get together with a knock it out of the ballpark proposal.

 

1.  This is not or will ever be difficult for any city that gets Amazon.  When Lockheed Martin announced that it was hiring 2k new employees, applicants came to the Fort Worth Convention Center from all of the country.  When Amazon selects the location of its 2nd Hqrs,  applicants will come from all of the world.  Housing will be built to meet any demand that is created.

 

2. DFW is not a city; it is a marketing brand.  Fort Worth is a city.  When State Farms and Toyota chose locations in Collins, Fort Worth and Dallas were losers.  The prosperity of Collins County does not equate to prosperity for Tarrant County or Fort Worth.  Fort Worth = Dallas, Dallas = Fort Worth, Suburbs = Fort
Worth is poppycock.

 

 

1. I basically disagree with that.  Would people come in droves from all around, if Amazon held a hiring day in San Angelo?  Yes.  And most of the people that would come are all the people who are currently out of a job and really need one.  Do you think that's Amazon's preferred method for hiring?  No, I think they want a location where the talent pool is already deep and wide.  High performing companies don't hire the bulk of their people from the pool of applicants that are desperate for a job.  They poach high performers from current roles. 

 

They basically said as much in the information they released (preference for large, educated workforce in the area).



#90 renamerusk

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 11:38 AM

1. I basically disagree with that.  Would people come in droves from all around, if Amazon held a hiring day in San Angelo?  Yes.  And most of the people that would come are all the people who are currently out of a job and really need one.  Do you think that's Amazon's preferred method for hiring?  No, I think they want a location where the talent pool is already deep and wide.  High performing companies don't hire the bulk of their people from the pool of applicants that are desperate for a job.  They poach high performers from current roles. 

 

They basically said as much in the information they released (preference for large, educated workforce in the area).

 

 I think that you may be underestimating how fluid the pool of workers are today and how much underemployment that there is in the national labor force.

 

 Where you live is not as important to an employer as are your skills and experience level.  With a population of 28million, Texas can easily fill Amazon's labor need,;but just because you are a Texan,  it will not secure the job for you.

 

Again, for Fort Worth, it comes down to location, location, and location:  #1- location - centrality within the U.S.; #2 - location - global and national access to major world centers (AA/DFW); and #3- location - 300-500 acres of centrally located land within the core of a city; and that = P.I.



#91 JBB

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 07:37 PM

Does anyone know if the parking lots along the ITC are available?  Many suggestions are being made about sites whose availability is unknown.   There is probably no harm to make these suggestions other than in their current state, they are inconsequential.

 
That question could be raised about any of the suggested sites, including Panther Island/TRV. 
 

I don't recall all the mechanics of the arrangement, but PI is full speed ahead regardless of funding. Tarrant Regional Water District has massive financial resources (why do you think the west side gang fought so hard to keep control?) and has been paying the bills for PI in anticipation of being repaid when federal funds and/or TIF money is available.


I appreciate this response. I've heard rumblings that the city would similarly dedicate resources to completing the project if federal funding didn't come together.

#92 renamerusk

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 07:44 PM

When was there ever any question raised about the availability of P.I.?

 

That question could be raised about any of the suggested sites, including Panther Island/TRV.


#93 JBB

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 07:50 PM

There wasn't specifically a question about that. You asked about the availability of the parking lots downtown and I was just pointing out that the same point applies elsewhere. Most of the land that will become Panther Island is in private hands.

#94 renamerusk

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 08:03 PM

There wasn't specifically a question about that. You asked about the availability of the parking lots downtown and I was just pointing out that the same point applies elsewhere. Most of the land that will become Panther Island is in private hands.

 

 Where are you getting your information. Correct me, but P.I. is owned by the TRWD/Trinity Vision.  The authority has purchased or acquired land through iminent domain.  There is not a patchwork of property owners elsewhere or more likely the parking lots downtown.  800 acres under the control and development of TRWD/Trinity Vision.  Where else is there a similar situation in Fort Worth?



#95 JBB

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 08:12 PM

I was under the impression that TRWD only acquired the land they needed for the bypass channel. I don't have time to fact check that information, but at the very least, La Grave field and the surrounding land is privately owned.

 

Edit: So is Panther Island Brewing at 501 N. Main.  I tried doing a georeference search for other area properties, but TAD's site isn't cooperating.

 

Edit 2: Scratch that on La Grave.  It is owned by the water district, but I believe the current proposal to field a team there calls for a private land owner to swap nearby land for the field with TRWD.



#96 AndyN

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 10:43 AM

I was under the impression that TRWD only acquired the land they needed for the bypass channel. I don't have time to fact check that information, but at the very least, La Grave field and the surrounding land is privately owned.

 

Edit: So is Panther Island Brewing at 501 N. Main.  I tried doing a georeference search for other area properties, but TAD's site isn't cooperating.

 

Edit 2: Scratch that on La Grave.  It is owned by the water district, but I believe the current proposal to field a team there calls for a private land owner to swap nearby land for the field with TRWD.

 

TRWD is probably the largest owner of property in the P.I. area. Followed by Panther Acquisition Partners, the current owner of LaGrave Field and nearby tracts. One of the larger parcels on the west side is still owned by Union Pacific/St. Louis Southwestern. I'm pretty sure they are willing to sell as they are no longer providing service to that site.

 

As others have reported, Jim Lane was longtime friends with Carl Bell and made arrangements for TRWD to buy several of Bell's tracts for above market rates when he was going through bankruptcy. But that is a matter for the politics page. The remainder of Bell's tracts including the ballpark went to his creditors who then sold to Panther Acquisitions. 

 

I'm sure Amazon could put together a sufficient sized tract to build a nice HQ.


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#97 renamerusk

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 01:48 PM

 

I was under the impression that TRWD only acquired the land they needed for the bypass channel. I don't have time to fact check that information, but at the very least, La Grave field and the surrounding land is privately owned.

 

Edit: So is Panther Island Brewing at 501 N. Main.  I tried doing a georeference search for other area properties, but TAD's site isn't cooperating.

 

Edit 2: Scratch that on La Grave.  It is owned by the water district, but I believe the current proposal to field a team there calls for a private land owner to swap nearby land for the field with TRWD.

 

TRWD is probably the largest owner of property in the P.I. area. Followed by Panther Acquisition Partners, the current owner of LaGrave Field and nearby tracts. One of the larger parcels on the west side is still owned by Union Pacific/St. Louis Southwestern. I'm pretty sure they are willing to sell as they are no longer providing service to that site.

 

As others have reported, Jim Lane was longtime friends with Carl Bell and made arrangements for TRWD to buy several of Bell's tracts for above market rates when he was going through bankruptcy. But that is a matter for the politics page. The remainder of Bell's tracts including the ballpark went to his creditors who then sold to Panther Acquisitions. 

 

I'm sure Amazon could put together a sufficient sized tract to build a nice HQ.

 

 

At this point and taking in account the fact surrounding Trinity River Vision, its astounding that suggestions other than P.I. are being taken seriously.



#98 PeopleAreStrange

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 05:45 PM

My concern with Panther Island is access. There is no direct access to Panther Island from 35W. You have to drive through downtown or the north side to access it by car. You also can't walk to it from the closest rail station.

 

If Panther Island were easier to access, it would be a fantastic location for Amazon's hew headquarters.


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#99 rriojas71

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 06:41 PM

As much as myself and every other person on the forum would love to have Amazon be a part of Fort Worth after reading an article today I just don't think we really stand a chance. FW is a great city but I think we have to many holes to fill to makes it a serious contender for Amazon.

We should instead as a city use this as a learning lesson for any future companies that may be looking for a city to build and relocate it's corporate campus here.

#100 Now in Denton

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 07:24 PM

All week I have been reading about whos in whos out ? And opinions are all over the map. And even Amazon twitted and said the NYTimes has it "wrong" No city is the front runner. And it got me thinking about facebook. Fort Worth beat 220 other cities. And in a year long fight. And even further back. When Fort Worth won the money plant back in the early 90"s or was it the 80's ? Anyway. I think it is a longshot for Fort Worth to get Amazon. But I think Fort Worth is more in contention then most people realize.  

 

Fort Worth gets facebook . http://rapidcityjour...6aed3bf2e3.html






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