Does the latest story coming out of Waco signals the beginning of yet another crisis that can threaten the survival of the conference?
#1
Posted 29 August 2015 - 12:40 PM
#2
Posted 29 August 2015 - 03:41 PM
Does the latest story coming out of Waco signals the beginning of yet another crisis that can threaten the survival of the conference?
As bad as that story is, I don't think that will have any bearing on the future of the conference.
#3
Posted 29 August 2015 - 03:50 PM
#4
Posted 29 August 2015 - 03:54 PM
Does the latest story coming out of Waco signals the beginning of yet another crisis that can threaten the survival of the conference?
....I don't think that will have any bearing on the future of the conference.
I really hope that it will have no bearing. I hope and pray that the Horned Frogs will not be abandoned by UT and OK supposing that BU gets the Penn State treatment. An outcome like that might give the Longhorns and Sooners to look elsewhere. An unofficial survey among the conference teams taken recently placed BU at the very bottom when it comes to favorability ratings.
#5
Posted 29 August 2015 - 04:03 PM
#6
Posted 29 August 2015 - 04:34 PM
Baylor isn't going to get the Penn State treatment, especially since most of the sanctions against Penn State were rescinded.
This story has quickly gone nationally. To be honest, it does not rise to the level of Penn State, however I think it is way too soon to know what will happen to BU.
It is possible and I do believe that it will lead to some stiff punishment, it could lead very likely to the coach and AD being asked to resign; and even the impeachment of Ken Starr.
Of course, should it lead eventually to the unraveling of the Big 12, then it could put TCU in jeopardy once again.
#7
Posted 29 August 2015 - 06:23 PM
You have to fire Art Briles though right? Especcially if its proven that he knew what happened and covered it up to let the guy play.
#8
Posted 30 August 2015 - 01:49 PM
If the balance of the Big 12 is so delicate that the woes of one school could bring the whole thing down, then the conference has far bigger problems than Baylor. And even if the conference did break up, TCU will land in another major conference in a heartbeat. If TCU's move to the Big 12 has proven anything, it's that they are a major player on the national stage.
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#9
Posted 31 August 2015 - 08:34 AM
He never played a down of football for Baylor. Once he was indicted, there wasn't an effort to cover anything up to allow him to play. Briles will probably be safe unless direct evidence emerges that he tried to interfere with the university investigation. At worst, I think this gets painted as a poor investigation by the school itself
OK so technically he didn't play a down. But did stay on scholarship for an additional ~13 months after the INDICTMENT. This means that he was obviously still going to school for free, but it also means that he was working out with the team and effectively was still a member of the team. And the defensive coordinator is on record only 2 months ago as saying that they expected him to play this Fall. That absolutely falls on Briles.
I don't think Briles gets fired, but something smells really bad when a member of his team stayed on scholarship for over a year after the player was indicted for a violent crime, not to mention the incredibly inept initial investigation the school ran prior to the indictment.
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#10
Posted 31 August 2015 - 10:28 AM
Too much history IMO for Baylor to not know the player's past.
I feel bad for the young lady who was raped, something that happens too frequently on college campuses (go hand and hand with binge drinking).
No trial would be needed if this happened to my daughter or one of my sons did something like this.
Briles won't get fired, but the endowment is going to decrease by a couple of million.
#11
Posted 31 August 2015 - 11:37 AM
#12
Posted 16 June 2016 - 03:21 PM
Baylor isn't going to get the Penn State treatment, especially since most of the sanctions against Penn State were rescinded.
....It is possible and I do believe that it will lead to some stiff punishment, it could lead very likely to the coach and AD being asked to resign; and even the impeachment of Ken Starr......Of course, should it lead eventually to the unraveling of the Big 12, then it could put TCU in jeopardy once again.
The Big 12 is very good for Fort Worth/North Texas. It has got to hold together, particularly for TCU. As previously stated, the news out of Waco is going from bad to worse; such that the situation really bares watching.
http://www.fortworth...3cc7910a3e.html
For certain, the Big 12 wants and needs a team in the Metroplex; and it could become necessary for the City and the hometown corporate forces (BNSF, AA, Lockheed, etc) to be active in stating the case for TCU. It can be argued that a successful athletic program has generated momentum for TCU to expand its footprint within the city such as a Medical School and an expanding Berry Street Initiative.
This is really not a knock on Baylor; I really hate this for them. Its about the economic impact of major collegiate sports to a town.
#13
Posted 26 July 2016 - 04:11 PM
Re: Baylor - things didn't turn out the way many expected. My only heartbreak is for the victims.
Re: The Big XII - not convinced of it's long-term prospects. I don't think the administrations of either Texas or OU will put the interests of the conference or the other schools before what they see as what's best for their respective universities. The conference would not likely last without both of those teams.
Re: TCU - If they continue to play at the level they are now, I think they'll be invited to a relevant conference if the Big XII unravels. If that happens, where would you like to see them? Just keep winning, baby. #gofrogs.
Re: UT - looking forward to seeing what that young team does this year. Here's hoping the new offensive system gels quickly. I liked Coach Strong at Louisville and I hope he has years of success in Austin. I love the type of players he's brought in. #hookem
#14
Posted 27 July 2016 - 11:15 AM
I can imagine technology will increase the way that viewers access entertainment and will reduce traditional tv/cable view numbers. Subsequently, there will be increase demand for an expansion of the CFP to get more teams/fans involved.
My hope is that the Big12 will just remain pat until the CFP expands from four team slots to 8 team slots. At the end of current TV contracts, a new system will give each of the five power conferences a guaranteed slot and will give three non-power conferences or at large teams a slot.
#15
Posted 27 July 2016 - 03:21 PM
Re: TCU - If they continue to play at the level they are now, I think they'll be invited to a relevant conference if the Big XII unravels. If that happens, where would you like to see them? Just keep winning, baby. #gofrogs.
I agree with this. There have been many times when conference realignment talk has caused me stress, but now I firmly believe that TCU has put itself in a position to be part of the "haves" whenever the "have nots" are culled from the herd.
#16
Posted 27 July 2016 - 06:56 PM
I watched BYUTV just today. I am a TCU fan for the record. But they had a sports program and they talked about how BYU fits the need for a expansion into the Big12. Several BYU pundits were beside themselves and salivating to join. One even said that "religion" may be the cause if they are not invited. BYU and TCU were in the same conference not long ago. They even said BYU may only get a football only invite. But BYU must understand the Big12 in my opinion is still on shaky ground. Big12 itself almost died not long ago. TCU joined the Big East for a few weeks before they also jumped into the Big 12. In my opinion I rather keep the conference from Texas to the upper plains. I also get "stress" as Jimmy says about conference adding or deleting schools.
I
#18
Posted 04 August 2018 - 11:51 AM
Check out the weekend on Sept 15 and 16, when BTS is in town. Not a single downtown hotel with rooms available.
TCU is also playing Ohio State, a team that travels well, at AT&T Stadium that weekend.
This is also the weekend that TCU plays Ohio State in AT&T Stadium. In the 2017 Cotton Bowl, attendance was 67,000 between Ohio State and Southern California; the crowd was 60% Ohio State, the rest was USC and local sales....On 9/14 - 9/16, Ohio State will be in Fort Worth/Arlington; they have already sold their allotment of 15,000 and have booked hotel spaces in Fort Worth, Arlington and Dallas....I would think that OSU alumni and fans make up a significant portion of the bookings in Downtown and Fort Worth.
TCU is also playing Ohio State, a team that travels well, at AT&T Stadium that weekend.
My point exactly.
GO HORNED FROGS!!!!
So, OSU is coming to town to play TCU on 9/15/18; and according to the OSU Fans Forum - Bucknuts, there will be thousands staying in the area, booking hotels and packing restaurants in around Sundance Square, Downtown, W7th and Near South. There is a somewhat relatable story in the Star Telegram on how Fort Worth and TCU have benefited each other. Think of the dollars added to the local economy by the massive construction taking place on TCU campus, the wealth coming to town from student/parents, the musical recognition from national and international piano recitals and competition; and on and on....
Bus for what this game mean to local businesses, here is what OSU alumni and the local chapter will be doing directly in Fort Worth/Arlington -
https://247sports.co...game-120209472/
#19
Posted 15 September 2018 - 09:33 AM
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#20
Posted 15 September 2018 - 01:13 PM
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#21
Posted 15 September 2018 - 05:36 PM
The bluebonnet sign is hilarious. Saw it too.
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#23
Posted 30 January 2019 - 01:43 PM
#24
Posted 30 January 2019 - 01:45 PM
The diamond/kite pattern around the next is weird, but I've seen worse looking football uniforms than that. The monochromatic look isn't as jarring as it used to be.
That's just for display.
Outside of all-white or black, you rarely see teams wear matching tops and bottoms anymore... it gives off that "spandex" look.
#25
Posted 30 January 2019 - 04:27 PM
I really like those new uniforms with their nod to the horned frog skin. I like even better the video that came out to introduce the new uniforms that includes a very cool tribute to Coach Patterson. Very nice!
https://www.star-tel...e225282725.html
(Coach P. video is the second one under the second line of the story.)
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#26
Posted 31 January 2019 - 01:20 PM
The diamond/kite pattern around the next is weird, but I've seen worse looking football uniforms than that. The monochromatic look isn't as jarring as it used to be.
They are to represent the horned frog spikes that surround the actual lizards neck
I love the new uniforms
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#27
Posted 31 January 2019 - 02:32 PM
I love them too. The road whites are best in the Big 12. Still not 100% behind the home combos.
#28
Posted 23 July 2021 - 12:13 AM
What! Longhorns and Sooners considering bailing to the SEC.
Not going to happen!
1. Texas A&M has veto power. Full stop for the Longhorns.
2. Sooners and OKST are bound by the OK Legislature as Pair or Nothing.
But just in case, Fort Worth is apparently strategizing what to do if TCU is left holding the bag.
My guess is that the only option for the Longhorns and the Sooners is to be Independent, like ND. I don't think that that option is as rosy as they would hope.
Then TCU, Baylor, Tech and OKSt will end up in an enlarged conference with teams on the Pacific Coast and Utah, Colo , AZ and AZSt.
My advice Fort Worth, Waco, Lubbock and Stillwater form a lobby.
#29
Posted 23 July 2021 - 05:12 AM
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#30
Posted 23 July 2021 - 10:32 AM
I reading that A&M will likely be joined by Florida, Georgia and SC. Like A&M, these schools have instate schools who want to be a part of any expansion - Florida St, Georgia Tech and Clemson.
Missouri chose to depart from the B12 because it believed Texas wielded too much clot, and also Oklahoma to some degree.
I think that Texas and Oklahoma are inching towards independence and want a network deal like ND has. I also think that they have sown some major distrust for the other 8 members. This will not go unnoticed by the current members of the SEC, in particularly MO and A&M. I think TX and OK may be left out to dry.
The B12 has been a great economic benefit for Fort Worth, but FW is fortunately in a much better situation than the cities of Lubbock, Waco and Stillwater where the college team is pours much needed money weekly into their local economy.
As for TCU, Baylor, Tech and OKST, the four schools should ban together and approach to current PAC 12 to form the easternmost sector of a newly created conference of 4x4 group created out of the existing PAC 12 and a disbanded B12.
At the end, this may just be egos at play because adding Texas and Oklahoma will create a lot of political headaches in the several states that the SEC cover.
#31
Posted 23 July 2021 - 01:39 PM
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#32
Posted 23 July 2021 - 02:07 PM
Likely true.
Here is where the rubber will meet the road. The other 8 members have now been put on notice and will band together or seek membership in other conferences. The Texas contingency (TCU, Baylor and Tech) will stick together IMO bringing in a large Texas market to an interested conference.
When you break a marriage and flirt with a new significant other, it doesn't necessarily turn out well for those who flirt. You may not receive the affection that you are seeking. I can think of a number of reasons why the TX/OK plot will be backfire. Now, the pin has been pulled in this hand grenade the 8 remaining schools will do what is in their best interest.
The suspicious eyes coming from all corners aimed at TX & OK will be well deserved.
#33
Posted 23 July 2021 - 02:49 PM
The "Big XIV" (7 remaining Big 12 members, 7 Go5)
Southeast: Baylor/Cincy/Houston/Memphis/TCU/UCF/USF
Northwest: Boise/BYU/ISU/Kansas/K-State/Ok. State/Tech
#34
Posted 23 July 2021 - 03:11 PM
First of all, the magic number is 16.
Secondly, this group combined will not bring in the amount of revenue that a Super Conference (B10/SEC) will command.
Rice, Houston, SMU are not going to be in the conversation, nor will BYU or Boise,; just my take.
I see a scenario where OK splits from TX and goes to SEC; and NC comes to SEC = 16 New schools from new states.
TX has no other option but Independent.
#35
Posted 23 July 2021 - 03:35 PM
First of all, the magic number is 16.
Secondly, this group combined will not bring in the amount of revenue that a Super Conference (B10/SEC) will command.
Rice, Houston, SMU are not going to be in the conversation, nor will BYU or Boise,; just my take.
I see a scenario where OK splits from TX and goes to SEC; and NC comes to SEC = 16 New schools from new states.
TX has no other option but Independent.
I doubt there will be a lot of "Independent" schools and doubt even more the NCAA lasts by the end of the decade.
I didn't bring up SMU or (especially) Rice.
That's just the only other possibility to keep this conference going. Take the best of the Group of 5 schools in the last decade and see what happens. Because either way, TCU and the rest of the Big XII is screwed with both Texas and OU leaving.
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#37
Posted 23 July 2021 - 04:49 PM
While that might look great on paper, it really doesn't touch upon the intense hatred and rivalry that exists between several of this grouping that will be nearly impossible to overcome.
The more I come to think about the TX/OK ploy the more I think that OK is playing TX for the pigeon. OK already has authority to vacate the Big 12 without OKST. So OK has a smoother ride into the SEC. OK may just be using TX for cover as it gets the invite along with NC and the two new members add up to 16. Do you really believe that OK would shed a tear if TX is left out on its own. Also OK can say that it was not alone in breaking up the Big12, it was TX too.
TX has to overcome A&M veto and that will not be easy or even possible. A&M was blindsided and so was MO. Now I can see a scenario where SC is lobbied to allow Clemson in; or where FL is lobbied to allow FLST in or where GA is lobbied to allow GT in. What a nest of hornets this has unleashed.
OK will just sit back and wait for an eastern counterpart to get an invitation from the SEC which could really be given to NC.
The bottom line is that the toothpaste is out of the tube, thanks to the TX/OK ploy.
Oh by the way, I recognized that you did not bring up either Rice or SMU. I just thought that it would be a waste of time to add them into the discussion when TCU and Baylor are themselves at risks even though the two are in a level above Rice and SMU.
Oddly enough, I don't believe that TCU and its regional partners are screwed by the leaving of TX and OK. I think that the Power Conference west of Texas will look more favorable upon TCU, Baylor and Tech. Who needs the drama of TX and OK when they show you that they are quite willing to blow things up.
It would not surprise me if TCU, BU, Tech and OKST have already made a package offer to another conference because of this. TCU has a recent history scheduling games with CA, Stanford, OR ,ORST and UT. CA is on the this season's home schedule. And so is UT: circle that date.
Together they stand; divided they fall.
#38
Posted 23 July 2021 - 05:32 PM
Really bad news for TCU and Fort Worth, but I am hopeful they can get something worked out that puts them in a positive position.
#39
Posted 23 July 2021 - 05:55 PM
Is there a confirmation and if so where is it being published? Has the SEC made any invitations official? How was A&M left out of the discussion? Ark? etc. To say that this has been going on for months should tell you that there is secrecy among the SEC that will be hard to smooth over.
And down in Austin,Texas and elsewhere across the state, this has touched a raw nerve.
https://www.burntora...ansion-politics
Lets wait and see if TX and Ok actually pull the trigger that will open a pandora's box
And while in Fort Worth, TCU has now instantly emerged as the favorite for a Longhorn decommit -
https://www.burntora...recruiting-2022
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#40
Posted 23 July 2021 - 06:56 PM
This whole saga went from no way this will happen to this looks like it will surely happen in less than 24 hours. Insane.
Really bad news for TCU and Fort Worth, but I am hopeful they can get something worked out that puts them in a positive position.
I wonder what school(s) are leaking to the press.
#41
Posted 23 July 2021 - 07:18 PM
Is there a confirmation and if so where is it being published? Has the SEC made any invitations official? How was A&M left out of the discussion? Ark? etc. To say that this has been going on for months should tell you that there is secrecy among the SEC that will be hard to smooth over.
And down in Austin,Texas and elsewhere across the state, this has touched a raw nerve.
https://www.burntora...ansion-politics
Lets wait and see if TX and Ok actually pull the trigger that will open a pandora's box
And while in Fort Worth, TCU has now instantly emerged as the favorite for a Longhorn decommit -
I swear to God, if Abbott tries to block this, but...
*sigh*
Forget it.
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#42
Posted 23 July 2021 - 09:49 PM
247 Sports insider Jeremy Clark reported last night that TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma State, and Texas Tech have already reached out to the Pac 12 to gauge interest. In plain words "they gone." 4+12 = 16. My intuition is proving to be very good.
As reported, JC is saying that this group of 4 now in conversation with the PAC 12 makes logical sense. Now, as I suspect, these 4 schools will be fine and much sought after as they represent a key foot hole into the Texas/Oklahoma base.
The next shoe to fall will be when the SEC slams the door in the face of Texas, but then issues an invitation to OK while all time knowing that it can get NC to complete the matching pair. I predict that the SEC will want to add a team in the east and a team in the west.
Texas may have been really punked by OK and ought to be scared as hell after blowing up the Big 12.
Texas will be ef'd without any place to fall back upon.
#43
Posted 24 July 2021 - 11:40 AM
My sole scenario now that the Big12 has been eviscerated by the OU/UT ploy:
New Conference (Empire Conference)
North - Washington, Washington St, Oregon, Oregon St
West - California, Stanford,UCLA, USC
Central - Utah, Colorado, Arizona, Arizona St
East - Baylor, Oklahoma St, TCU, Texas Tech
The ludricrous idea that to have Texas recruits and exposure, you need the Longhorns. Ridiculous!
With the East Group in place, you get plenty of Texas/Okla exposure without the Longhorns Drama.
#44
Posted 24 July 2021 - 10:03 PM
My sole scenario now that the Big12 has been eviscerated by the OU/UT ploy:
New Conference (Empire Conference)
North - Washington, Washington St, Oregon, Oregon St
West - California, Stanford,UCLA, USC
Central - Utah, Colorado, Arizona, Arizona St
East - Baylor, Oklahoma St, TCU, Texas Tech
I actually like this...
Maybe call it the "Western 16"
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#45
Posted 25 July 2021 - 06:10 AM
If Texas and Oklahoma Bolt to the SEC, What Happens to the Rest of the Big 12?
#46
Posted 25 July 2021 - 06:43 AM
I'm all for college football play-offs. Maybe the transition to real playoffs will eliminate the wonky distribution of power and profit-focused conference management. The conferences should be determined by geography, and conference management should focus on the competitive ebb & flow of each team -- if a smaller school has a great team for 4-8 years, that team should immediately bounce up to play similarly skilled teams, when the school's team begins to slip, the next year schedule is adjusted.
Let the politics of governing all the money in college football shift down stream to make ensure year-to-year schedule nimbleness so a team rising in prominence and ability is equally matched. The national championship becomes a true playoff scenario.
#47
Posted 25 July 2021 - 09:41 AM
#48
Posted 26 July 2021 - 08:37 AM
In case anyone was doubting that something is about to happen, Texas and Oklahoma have announced that they will allow their current media rights contracts to expire.
#49
Posted 26 July 2021 - 11:33 AM
I would be surprised to hear that Oklahoma State and Texas Tech would be making the move if the Pac12 were to be opening their conference to expansion. The very first school I would engage is BYU, a current independent that gives them a rival with Utah, a geographic bridge that continues to help Colorado and school that fits the academic makeup of the conference. Both Tech and OKST would enter the conference as the weakest academic institutions based on entry requirements and World News rankings. I know USA Today and world news rankings are flawed, but the conference was insistent about who they admitted last time about adhering to those metrics and that's why Colorado was the choice at the time. The other thing that becomes an issue outside of cultural fit is the actual competition. Its 11:00a kickoff locally vs 9:00a on the coast, its the sports outside of football, is Tech adding beach volleyball, water polo, lacrosse, rugby ect to match their conference foes? will the be members in only certain sports? Club in others. Which makes the stronger case that OU competition wise with things like Women's Gymnastics and UT with the academic standards are the best fits out of the Big12 going to the PAC12. but alas . . . .
I would think the best possible scenario, and the one that makes the most logical sense is to work towards football leaving the NCAA entirely. The NIL helps that first step, but I could see TCU, possibly Baylor fitting the look of the PAC12, but would guess it would be more likely that one or the other would get BYU to join and what is left of the Big12 is better suited to rob from the Mountain West and the American. It goes back to everyone agreeing that 16 teams is the goal. And based on geography and academics I'm not sure where the Pac12 gets there, Boise State is not in the same class and wouldn't fit, UNLV? San Diego State, as about to get into, i could see the Mountain west getting blown up, forcing the remaining schools there to join the WAC.
Here would be my best possible scenario for maintaining the current remaining teams in the Big 12
Boise State, Colorado State, Airforce, Tech Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, Cincinnati, Memphis, SMU, Houston, Tulane, Tulsa
This would still be a top 5 conference in football and be a tremendous basketball conference.
West: East:
Boise State Ok State
Colorado State Kansas
Airforce Kansas State
Texas Tech Iowa State
TCU Cincinnati
Baylor Memphis
Houston Tulsa
SMU Tulane
#50
Posted 26 July 2021 - 12:21 PM
Here would be my best possible scenario for maintaining the current remaining teams in the Big 12
Boise State, Colorado State, Airforce, Tech Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, Cincinnati, Memphis, SMU, Houston, Tulane, Tulsa
This would still be a top 5 conference in football and be a tremendous basketball conference.
West: East:
Boise State Ok State
Colorado State Kansas
Airforce Kansas State
Texas Tech Iowa State
TCU Cincinnati
Baylor Memphis
Houston Tulsa
SMU Tulane
You know... the more I look at this and think about it, the more I think that it's just a glorified demotion for TCU.
It would be just like the Mountain West days were we dominated year in and year out. Sure, things could change, but that's just how I'm feelin' right now.
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