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Central Tourism District

Redefinding the CBD

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#101 renamerusk

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Posted 05 September 2017 - 08:16 PM

..... But, despite extensive discussion here from proponents and opponents of a downtown aimed at  tourists and permanent residents, it's still a central business district.  It  needs a strong office and retail market.  

 

Office/employment decisions should not be the purview of a city.  Businesses create and eliminate jobs; and as it has always been, controlling labor costs and striving for productivity is what businesses do by investing in technology and downsizing where ever the possibility present itself.  Cities create and invest in neighborhoods.  

 

The City is doing exactly as it should be doing - creating the environment for a vibrant Downtown Neighborhood - improvement to the CC; building a new arena; the beautification of the Downtown.  High among the thing that the City should be doing is taking steps to secure a sufficient supply of affordable housing in Downtown. A mixture consisting of a greater proportion of residential to employment will lessen the impact of future employment downsizing; sustain a healthy retail sector; and vibrant pedestrian and leisure sector.

 

That the hotel and residential markets are keen to come into Downtown, while at the same time, employment is leaving or remaining static is a sign that Fort Worth is headed in the correct direction.

 

Even though it still seems like a central business district, the future business of Downtown will be tourism, residential, hospitality and entertainment.



#102 Dylan

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Posted 06 September 2017 - 12:54 AM

[SNIP]


 

That the hotel and residential markets are keen to come into Downtown, while at the same time, employment is leaving or remaining static is a sign that Fort Worth is headed in the correct direction.

 

Even though it still seems like a central business district, the future business of Downtown will be tourism, residential, hospitality and entertainment.

 

 

Why does downtown have to lose employment in order to gain residents and visitors? They are not mutually exclusive.

 

We're moving in the correct direction when it comes to hospitality, but we're stepping backwards when it comes to employment.


-Dylan


#103 tamtagon

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Posted 06 September 2017 - 06:05 AM

Office workers will increase in and around a downtown that's increasingly a better place to live as well as a more popular leisure destination. 



#104 johnfwd

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Posted 06 September 2017 - 07:15 AM

Office workers will increase in and around a downtown that's increasingly a better place to live as well as a more popular leisure destination. 

Often I see two sides of an argument.  I hope you're right about an increase in office workers downtown.  However, office workers don't just rent housing and show up as tourists...the point about CBD vs. CTD is that Class A Office buildings enjoy increased occupancy.  When that happens, it doesn't matter whether office workers live in or outside downtown.  Tourism, of course, is a different marketing strategy.

 

One trend away from Class A Office building occupancy downtown (unfortunately!) is for corporations to favor "horizontal" designed campuses.  Radio Shack locally was part of this trend when it preferred the low-rise river-front campus (that is now TCC's downtown campus).  Lately TXO/Exxon has moved from a high-rise downtown tower to a new low-rise corporate campus near Houston.

 

One underlying contributing factor for preference for low-rise corporate campuses is the trend away from the vertical hierarchical organization model (i.e., the big execs occupy the top floors and supporting cast on the lower floors).  This is not a new trend...the horizontal organization model began in the 1970s when U.S. corporations started to imitate the Japanese style of teamwork--that is to say, allowing the workers to participate with the big execs in the decision-making process.  A decentralization of a sort.  When a corporation adopts this model they prefer to be on the same structural plane as the workers.  Ergo, the low-rise corporate campus. 

 

There are other factors for low-rise corporate campuses--among them the pleasurable aesthetic of working closer to trees, flowers, and lakes.  Another factor is the desire to work in the suburbs rather than downtown because it's a less stressful environment and easier transportation access.  This doesn't mean that all corporate campuses will be low-rise structures.  There are exceptions (see Post#54).

 

The point I'm making against CBD is that this trend may be adverse to the high-rise office tower downtown.  It's only going to be more adverse in the future as land scarcity downtown results in vertical rather than horizontal building construction.



#105 renamerusk

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Posted 06 September 2017 - 09:39 AM

Office workers will increase in and around a downtown that's increasingly a better place to live as well as a more popular leisure destination. 

 

 I agree with your predication.  Young people living in Downtown will become an attractive labor market for employers and retailers.  People of all income brackets will dine in the restaurants and enjoy the entertainment of Downtown.  Tourists and conventioneers will add to the mixture. 

 

Downtown Fort Worth is the responsibility of the City.  The responsibility of Downtown can not be left to the office market alone.



#106 renamerusk

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 10:08 AM

A recent trip through Austin and an overnight in San Antonio is more convincing evidence that tourism and conventions/conferences is the way forward for Downtown. 

 

Austin is a hive of hotels and high rise residential towers (brand names illuminated 30/40 stories in sky) and San Antonio was filled with meetings of groups from all across the state. 

 

The key for ginning up Fort Worth will be getting the convention center expanded and improved.  This should be done yesterday.



#107 JBB

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 10:36 AM

And no plan to fund it or make it happen tomorrow, or the day after that, or the day after that...

Not including the Convention Center expansion and a makeover of the Will Rogers complex in the arena bond package might have been the safe play, but it wasn't the smart one.

#108 John T Roberts

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 10:51 AM

I think there will have to be another bond election with money allocated to demolish the existing arena and build new convention space within its place.  I know there has also been some talk about building another Convention Center Hotel that would be physically attached to the center, itself.  Would the hotel be included in the bond, or would that be with private money on public property?



#109 JBB

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 10:57 AM

I would rather see a private developer fund another hotel or at least under the same arrangement as the Omni. If there's not a real market for at the least a similar arrangement, I'm not interested in seeing the city get into the hotel business.

#110 renamerusk

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 10:59 AM

....Not including the Convention Center expansion and a makeover of the Will Rogers complex in the arena bond package might have been the safe play, but it wasn't the smart one.

 

Yes, it was not smart; it was unchecked and entitlement based influence on which would go first or even if the convention center will ever be expanded.

 

Seemingly, the decision was to placate the WRMC interest over Downtown.  The cynical part of me thinks that more outside hotels and residential developers would be seen as a threat to the major stakeholder's grip on Downtown; and it is why a second independent square is needed to loosen that grip. 

 

Austin and San Antonio are testaments to a unfettered tourism and conference strategy as outside developers have flooded each city's downtown.



#111 johnfwd

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 02:06 PM

I would rather see a private developer fund another hotel or at least under the same arrangement as the Omni. If there's not a real market for at the least a similar arrangement, I'm not interested in seeing the city get into the hotel business.

 

Seems to me that current plans to build a number of hotels by private developers is filling the need for more hotel rooms in downtown Fort Worth.  These plans include two or three high-rise hotels in the immediate vicinity of the Convention Center.  Is there even a need for the City of Fort Worth to get into the hotel business?



#112 JBB

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 02:26 PM

The city has stated that there's a need for another hotel similar to the Omni that could possibly be directly connected to the convention center. I believe the idea is that the new space won't be needed until the arena is demolished and replaced with more exhibit and meeting areas.

I also believe John is making a reference to the history behind the development of the Omni. The city attempted to build a convention center hotel in the early 00s that was to be city owned and operated. The project was to be paid for with bonds that were not voter approved. A large petition campaign to have the project go on the ballot was successful and the project in that form was scuttled. Omni was brought in to the talks and, rather than a publicly financed hotel, they were given massive tax breaks to build the hotel/condo building that exists today.

To give a much shorter answer, I don't think there's ever a need for a city government to own and operate a hotel.

#113 renamerusk

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 03:48 PM

Regardless, it was and continues to be a bad decision to delay and to delay the convention project.  Hotel and convention planners need to know that Fort Worth is serious about this business in spite of the City continuous capitulation to its imperial family who never ever seems satisfied or willing to relinquish power and influence for its own self benefit.



#114 rriojas71

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 05:34 PM

....Not including the Convention Center expansion and a makeover of the Will Rogers complex in the arena bond package might have been the safe play, but it wasn't the smart one.

 
Austin and San Antonio are testaments to a unfettered tourism and conference strategy as outside developers have flooded each city's downtown.
The one difference with trying to compare us with Austin & San Antonio and getting tourists, conventions and conferences is that neither of them have a larger city 30 miles to the East that battling for those same conventions.

#115 renamerusk

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 06:25 PM

The one difference with trying to compare us with Austin & San Antonio and getting tourists, conventions and conferences is that neither of them have a larger city 30 miles to the East that battling for those same conventions.....

 

Even though that is true, the situation inow is that Fort Worth does not have ample infrastructure currently in place (hotels, space) to bid for comparable conventions and conferences; so it is not entirely a function of a larger city within a short distance.  For now, this gives Dallas an advantage. 

 

Both Austin and San Antonio have developed their own identities: Austin weird and cool; San Antonio lovely and historic.  Fort Worth on the other hand is not definitive in owning its identity and continues to see as  "DFW is a city baloney"; and for which Fort Worth regularly becomes viewed as an extension of the larger city.

 

A few things need to happen:

 

1. Have national convention facilities (space/hotels)

2. establish more entertainment venues beyond Sundance Square yet within Downtown

3. create/identify a national/global industry and have it become associated with Fort Worth



#116 johnfwd

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Posted 29 November 2017 - 08:12 AM

We've discussed here ad infinitem, but that's okay, that Fort Worth is viewed as part of the DFW metroplex.  The Cowtown culture of FW has also been a frequent topic but I think the media and maybe the public at large still view the Stockyards as our identity.  I'm impressed by your item #2, the location of more entertainment venues sans SS downtown.  Got any particular venue in mind?



#117 renamerusk

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Posted 29 November 2017 - 09:25 AM

..... the location of more entertainment venues sans SS downtown.  Got any particular venue in mind?

 

A great and fun question to answer.

 

Whats came to mind in the past: SE sector (ITC/CC/A&M); or SW sector (City Hall/T&P); or NW sector (W of Taylor/N of 3rd); any of which have been and still remain on my wish-list.

 

The NW sector has always seemed to be neglected perhaps because of the "psychological barrier" that the Tandy Center/City Place complex created. 

 

If and when 3rd Street is redesign to connect the NW sector with the "Throckmorton/Houston/Main" corridors, the NW sector can flourish as a high and mid-rise residential neighborhood.  The NW sector has remarkable access/infrastructure in place now: Henderson St (199), 7th St., Forest Park Blvd,  Belknap-Weatherford Sts., TCC - "a developer's dream".   And then there is the "riverfront". 

 

The "riverfront" or what has evolved into the Panther Island Pavilion (PIP) is a grassroot, corporate-less entertainment venue which targets a different market from the establishment core market. Evidently, developers now see this sector as the place where ownership is not in the hands of a single entity and that has the potential for outside developers to enter Downtown in an area close to both the  Cultural District and the Business District. The PIP neighborhood, happily to my surprise at least, will likely change and add to the profile of Downtown by infilling the area between SS and SH199.

 

In the future, Henderson@Belknap-Weatherford will become the major crossroad of Downtown.  A second transit center should be added to this sector ( transit line/City Place).

 

I am sure that I am leaving out something, but it is exciting to see new outside developers making a push into Downtown.



#118 renamerusk

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 12:56 PM

 I would like to coin a new term for Downtown - Central Tourism District (CTD) to replace Central Business District (CBD)

 

 CTD will become the major player in Downtown with new high rise residential structures and high rise hospitality structures.

 

The future of Downtown looks to me, at least, to becoming the destination for tourists, conventioneers, restaurants, entertainment and housing.

 

Revisiting my thoughts and finding evidence that they are sound:

 

http://www.fortworth...add1d88380.html



#119 RD Milhollin

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 10:36 AM

3. create/identify a national/global industry and have it become associated with Fort Worth

 

 

Energy. Sustainable energy.



#120 renamerusk

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 10:48 AM

 

3. create/identify a national/global industry and have it become associated with Fort Worth

 

 

Energy. Sustainable energy.

 

  One associates Houston only as the Center of Fossil Fuel Processing and Exporting; however,  Houston has increasingly become associated with the ownership of, administration of and developers of clean sustainable energy.  There is now a fast growing sustainable energy employment sector associated with Houston.

 

 I think that the growing awareness of Fort Worth as a cultural and western/agricultural center is the best avenue to sustain Downtown. Fort Worth is also a leader in the brewery and distillery cottage industry. 

 

 It is not often commented upon, but Fort Worth has forged a great association with classical and contemporary music with the Cliburn, TCU Piano Festivals, Niles City, Fortress Festival, Texas Wesleyan Junior Piano, Billy Bob's/Stockyards.

 

And oh by the way, The Museums and the Great Zoo!

 

Overall, the future of Fort Worth is tourism and logistics; more hotels and conferences/meetings.



#121 roverone

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 01:05 PM

I don't dislike tourism, but I do wonder how it actually pours money into the local economy.  Hospitality jobs are not the highest paying.  Many of the accommodations are in hotels that are not locally owned, although there are steep local taxes I suppose.  Many of the restaurants are also not locally owned.  The kind of retail that visitors visit might have a slightly better chance of being locally owned.  Getting people here to sightsee just seems far less good than attracting businesses here with high paying jobs.  Of course, business-owner's first contact with the city may be though a tourism visit.  But I just don't see how tourism is building up our workforce.  It might be different if we had some kind of behemoth attraction, like Disney that had to employ a large scope of people, but even then...  I wish we could more widely spread out the worker expertise that we do have at our aerospace employers -- somehow become more of a hub of skill in the areas that they employ -- but I guess there is just not enough need for that kind of engineering and manufacturing outside of defense.



#122 renamerusk

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 02:29 PM

I don't dislike tourism, but I do wonder how it actually pours money into the local economy......

 

Absence some gigantic concentrated tourist district such the one in Arlington, tourism is not easily understood and apparent. However, the cumulative impact of multiple points of interest do make an enormous impact upon the local economy.  You may want to delve more into tourism as being an industry.

 

Whereas businesses adjust their labor and service demands by hiring and downsizing and even relocating when necessary, tourism can be a stable stream of revenue that comes from the outside and when and as long as Fort Worth capitalizes on the uniqueness of its character, tourists and conferees will be attracted the City.  Fort Worth can also compete for enormous amount of annual meetings more readily than it can compete for a handful of businesses who setup or relocate annually.

 

Like I have suggested, Fort Worth is probably on the verge of becoming the Music Capital of Texas and could challenge Austin for that title.

 

I think that the institutions already exist in Fort Worth to facilitate a robust and sustainable year round tourist industry.  Already small locally owned hotels and restaurants are opening and restaurant owners from Houston and Austin have begun to move into Fort Worth.  Overall, the growth in tourism will increase sales and tax receipts as well as providing jobs for the hospitality workers and wholesale food vendors.  Where there is a healthy tourism base, a healthy real estate market accompanies it. 

 

So, tourism and Downtown Fort Worth will spur residential development and the stream of outside money into the local economy will be strong.



#123 roverone

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 07:33 AM

Again, I'm not saying that tourism is a bad thing, but in the absence of some natural wonder, or Disney-like facility, we are just piecing together some version of our history and hoping it will attract enough people.  We would need better facilities to get meetings, and some other selling point on why Fort Worth instead of any number of other places around the country.  We will never get large conventions, because that probably takes 2+ million square feet of space and large contiguous hotels.   Even with all of that, I still don't think that tourism is a high-wage industry.

 

At least in my part of the city, the real estate market already seems very healthy.  But I really don't know where they are employed -- it would be super interesting to know.

 

And the last thing that I will say is that many of the things that are claimed as our tourist draws are here exactly because of business -- the stockyards were here because of that business, and at least two of our great museums were started by families of businesses here, and of course, our Sundance is a project for commerce with community benefits.

 

I just am not yet convinced that tourism is where our energies should focus, but rather creating a lifestyle that people want to move their businesses to for the long term, not for a few day's visit.  Again, I'm not anti-tourism, but I am concerned if someone suggests that we should give up on downtown being a place where people work, and it should be a place where people just come to visit.



#124 John T Roberts

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 08:30 AM

Roverone, there are plans to expand the Convention Center into the space where the arena is now located.  Hopefully, with this expansion, we can attract bigger conventions and more hotels.



#125 roverone

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 09:18 AM

I'm familiar with the convention center expansion -- I think I've mentioned that we made an offer on the 915 Houston Savings & Loan building and as a part of that process we thought long and hard about how that construction would disrupt that part of town, and how the new facilities would (hopefully) enhance the character of that area.  I expect the same documents that I was reading back then have been used time and time again to support the multitude of smaller hotel projects in town (despite the fact that consolidated rooms in a bigger hotel are probably more supportive of convention space).

 

What I meant to say is that we are unlikely to ever have convention space that competes with the big places, like McCormick Chicago, LVCC, Orlando, Atlanta, New Orleans, Cleveland, or even Dallas.

 

I'm sure someone on this forum can probably speak to the breakdown of economic impact from conventions -- it would be interesting to me to know where the money really goes.  In particular, how much makes its way to important non-convention infrastructure things like schools and roads, etc.

 

Something else I think would be interesting, and we could surely synthesize, is the comparative economic impact of businesses in the downtown area, as compared to hospitality and other sectors.  I expect that data is in one of the recently posted documents and I will look for it later when I have more time.



#126 johnfwd

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 09:36 AM

I get that the core of your thoughts is that tourism itself cannot be the primary driver of economic development in Fort Worth or any city.  The Chamber of Commerce and city tourism authorities work together to generate a profile to promote the city based partly on tourist attractions but also on other factors such as educational facilities and transportation infrastructure.  The objective is to grow commercially and industrially.  If tourism were the principal driver of economic development, wouldn't you think Arlington would be surpassing Dallas and Fort Worth in that regard?  When I think of Arlington I think of Six Flags over Texas and AT&T Stadium more so than I think of the GM plant.



#127 renamerusk

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 01:37 PM

#1....If tourism were the principal driver of economic development, wouldn't you think Arlington would be surpassing Dallas and Fort Worth in that regard?  When I think of Arlington I think of Six Flags over Texas and AT&T Stadium more so than I think of the GM plant.

 

 

#2.... we are unlikely to ever have convention space that competes with the big places, like McCormick Chicago, LVCC, Orlando, Atlanta, New Orleans, Cleveland, or even Dallas.

 

#3....it would be interesting to me to know where the money really goes.  In particular, how much makes its way to important non-convention infrastructure things like schools and roads, etc.

 

 #1 - Interesting perspective.  It is hard to identify any other city in the region with such a tourist punch as Arlington.  As a city, Arlington  likely surpasses both Dallas and Fort Worth in tourism economy.  Jointly, Arlington with a significant tourism industry based within Fort Worth combined, in a study that right now escapes me, to make Tarrant County the state's leader in tourism.  I recall that San Antonio was a very close second.  The GM Plant is indicative of most industries that seek to increase productivity through automation and periods of downtime and reduction of labor.  Tourism behaves differently and requires labor intensive jobs that are not solely based upon being the most efficient but  upon delivering the highest levels of quality and service.

 

So the predicate of a Central Tourism District is the steps that Fort Worth can do, such as tourism infrastructure, that the private sector will not do.

 

#2 - It is impossible to prove a negative, but it is possible to become more competitive with the proper infrastructure which until now Fort Worth lacks.  Realistically, every city is on its own and should not cede anything to other cities by upping their profile; and so must Fort Worth. The new arena and an enlarged convention center will garner enough of the mid size conventions and continue to hold on to many regional meetings so that the cumulative impact will be significant and noticeable.

 

#3- Tourism dollars spent within Fort Worth presumably find their way to schools and roads; whereas businesses that have by in large relocated in Fort Worth's outer areas have landed within non-FWISD districts.  I am certainly among the strongest proponents for Class A office space and the potential jobs that it would bring to Downtown. But as we have witnessed over the past 30 years, Downtown has under performed relative to its pier cities and most noticeably other parts within North Texas when it comes to the next generation of office space. The cycle where new space creates demand and demand creates new space has not happened Downtown and instead has proliferated to the east and north of Tarrant County.  The industry that seems to have done much better during this period is Tourism within our county. I believe that the sturdy growth in tourism which until now has not been fully driven can create a Downtown that is different from its counterparts in North Texas but is as vibrant and sustainable as those same counterparts. 

 

Lets assume that a new business will bring into Downtown 5,000 new workers, some who would and some who would not live in Fort Worth, but who would spend a portion of their salary with Downtown businesses; we can agree that that is a positive impact.  However, if you could attract 5,000 tourists per week to Downtown and surrounding attractions, who would then bring in about 80% or more spending from the outside, the fortunes of the City are enhanced. If the City chooses a turn to radically increase tourism for Downtown in light of the Class Office market largely choosing to ignore Downtown, then again, Fort Worth directs the future of Downtown in lieu of businesses who make decisions that actualize their own particular goals.



#128 johnfwd

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 08:39 AM

I've enjoyed reading most of the ideas posted here.  I still have difficulty conceiving of a downtown transformation from Central Business District to Central Tourism District, if that's what is being proposed.  Hotels, restaurants, convention center activities, tourist spots like the Water Gardens, Bass Performance Hall--all these features I can deal with as parts of our downtown.  These attract tourists.  But making an entire downtown a tourist attraction, in my view, is a stretch of the imagination.  Maybe I misunderstood what a CTD was to be in this context.  Downtowns have historically been a centralization of business, commerce, and public institutions like courthouses, as well as a place for people to live...and not meant solely for amusement, entertainment, culture, and history.

 

Not meaning to denigrate a CTD perspective.  I heartily in favor of tourism. I think, for one, the Stockyards is a CTD or can become one.



#129 tamtagon

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 09:38 AM

Downtowns have historically been a centralization of business, commerce, and public institutions like courthouses, as well as a place for people to live...and not meant solely for amusement, entertainment, culture, and history.

 

Downtowns have also been a centralization of recreation, cultural and social events... until at least air conditioning and cars allowed people to live further and further away from the noise and constant bustle. The suburbs may have started as quiet places where every family could have ample land and living space, they have grown into a hodge-podge of decentralized business districts and as a result everything got watered down, homogenized and unvaried, tragically skewed toward those with abundant disposable income.

 

The coming phase for suburbs and downtown environments is finding a balance that continues to provide elbow room and activity in the suburban yarded neighborhood areas while remembering the benefit of concentrations of amusement, entertainment, cultural and social activities in the downtown area (aka tourism).

 

More than any other town in Texas, Fort Worth has the bones to become the downtown people visit for the downtown experience. It's not struggling as much to overcome infrastructure modifications that catered to suburban commuters stripping the environment of pedestrian enjoyment, and is not hellbent on reinventing the wrought office space business district. Being in the city because it's full of different kinds of stuff to do and full of people looking for different kinds of stuff to do. 



#130 renamerusk

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Posted 21 February 2019 - 03:18 PM

 

Downtowns have historically been a centralization of business, commerce, and public institutions like courthouses, as well as a place for people to live...and not meant solely for amusement, entertainment, culture, and history.

 

# 1 -Downtowns have also been a centralization of recreation, cultural and social events... until at least air conditioning and cars allowed people to live further and further away from the noise and constant bustle.....

 

 #2 -the benefit of concentrations of amusement, entertainment, cultural and social activities in the downtown area (aka tourism)......

 

#3 -More than any other town in Texas, Fort Worth has the bones to become the downtown people visit for the downtown experience. It's not struggling as much to overcome infrastructure modifications that catered to suburban commuters stripping the environment of pedestrian enjoyment, and is not hellbent on reinventing the wrought office space business district....

 

Stated with a clear understanding of the times.

#1... :)

#2... :) :)

#3... :) :) :)



#131 renamerusk

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Posted 08 March 2019 - 02:55 PM

Beyonce's sister Solange filmed a music video with some scenes at the Water Gardens recently.....

 

 This is an example of how Fort Worth can make a safe pivot to a tourist economy for Downtown.  Coupled with the Stockyards and museums like the Modern and Kimbell, each having iconic facades, I believe exposure through film and video are absolutely job generators.



#132 johnfwd

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Posted 11 March 2019 - 07:32 AM

I agree that exposure to films and video is good for Fort Worth or any city.  Just viewed that Solange music video (another thread) and saw two brief Water Gardens' scenes.  Unfortunately for our city, no lyrics in this music video had anything in it identifying Fort Worth as the locale of these scenes; in fact, I thought I heard repeated the words "Florida waters" (my ears usually don't tune in well to what these music videos are saying).

 

Now if Randolph Scott's old western cowboy classic, "Fort Worth," didn't up our city in the national spotlight back in the 1950s I don't know what will. 



#133 Austin55

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 04:41 PM

DFWI and Visit Fort Worth are coning the area around the Center the "Convention Center District"

 

https://twitter.com/...728896451993602



#134 renamerusk

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 04:46 PM

Wow! This is something I don't believe we were aware of.  Hotel (plural) and an unidentified 30-story high rise. This sounds like something entirely new and out of the blue.



#135 John T Roberts

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 05:17 PM

This actually makes sense, since the Convention Center is going to be partially demolished and reconfigured. 

 

Austin, do you have any links to Andy Taft's presentation?



#136 Austin55

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 06:28 PM

I do not.

 

Edit-  although this one is similar  http://fortworthtexa...06730772001.pdf



#137 John T Roberts

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 07:28 PM

Thanks for the update.



#138 renamerusk

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 08:00 PM

Well, DFWI/VFW has all but confirmed that there is a plan well underway (30-story is quite a specific hint) for one of the surface parking lots immediately to the east of the CC. 

 

Actually sounds like it could be TOD @ FWCS.



#139 johnfwd

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 11:30 AM

Is the 30-story tower to be part of the Convention Center expansion (once the demolition of existing portions is finished) or a separate hotel?



#140 renamerusk

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 11:52 AM

It is not being teased as a hoteI,  so I suspect that the 30-story tower is more to do with TOD than it does with the CC. My assumption is that it will be mixed office and residential/retail like this Portland, OR 30-story mixed use tower. (lots of tree-lined streets).

 

29107026-aerial-view-of-portland-skyline

 

If so, it will be the second project (Katy Station) directly connected to Tarrant Express and Trinity Rail Express.

 

Assuming that Omni has a second tower in its plans, the City of Fort Worth has a CC Hotel in its plans, and this new yet to be formalized tower makes for 3 high-rise projects which will be rolled out in the next 5-7 years for this too long quiet sector of Downtown.  Also 901 Commerce is kick starting the massing of the SE sector of Downtown along with the much anticipated Texas A&M complex.



#141 Dylan

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 08:41 PM

Could the 30-story tower refer to the postponed 1,000+ room convention center hotel?

 

http://www.fortworth...?showtopic=6163


-Dylan


#142 renamerusk

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 09:17 PM

Could the 30-story tower refer to the postponed 1,000+ room convention center hotel?

 

Per the tweet, 

 

https://twitter.com/...28896451993602

 

its wording is punctuated by a comma between High rise and hotels.  I am guessing that because there has not been a formal RFP by Fort Worth for a hotel, it is not the convention center hotel; and it appears not to be another hotel.   I think that not 10 or not 40 but 30-story suggests that there may be actual rendering with details that have not yet been made public.  It could also be the Omni expansion, but again it does not specify a hotel use.

 

Also, I am thinking that it is by a new developer coming to Fort Worth. (Austin spillover).  I remember reading that Austin developers were looking at Fort Worth with some interest after the successful Fort Worth Now/House Campaign during SXSW.



#143 roverone

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 09:32 PM

I haven't followed this thread version closely, but this 30 story building is not the 901 Commerce project?



#144 renamerusk

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 09:50 PM

I haven't followed this thread version closely, but this 30 story building is not the 901 Commerce project?

 

  But you really should.  Fort Worth is taking its future into its own hands. Corporate office growth is not likely to happen here in a scale that it is happening just to the east.

 

Tourism, residential, hotels, conventions and meetings create an economic strategy package that has the potential to really pay off big time for the City.  Glad to see the cylinders of the three economic drivers: FWSY, DTFW and C/E District starting to pop.



#145 rriojas71

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 11:53 AM

 
Assuming that Omni has a second tower in its plans, the City of Fort Worth has a CC Hotel in its plans, and this new yet to be formalized tower makes for 3 high-rise projects which will be rolled out in the next 5-7 years for this too long quiet sector of Downtown.  Also 901 Commerce is kick starting the massing of the SE sector of Downtown along with the much anticipated Texas A&M complex.

In my 5 years since I have moved back I have learned to never assume a high rise project announcement will ever get built until it starts to actually rise up from the ground.
That way I can keep my disappointment levels at a minimum

#146 johnfwd

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 12:27 PM

Yeah, in Fort Worth it's wise to be a doubting Thomas about proposed big downtown projects.



#147 renamerusk

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 01:27 PM

5 years ago there was reason to be a "Doubting Thomas" but the opening of a world class Sinclair "Boutique" Hotel along with the u/c AC Hotel, two repurposed historic buildings (Waggoner, 714 Main) are providing evidence that a change is now underway for Downtown.

 

I will repeat over and over again, that if you judge Fort Worth by the manifestation of office towers rather than by what Fort Worth does better than all of the competition within the area (culture, art), then the face of Fort Worth should reflect it best.  I think that the DA and the Tarrant Express Rail are setting up the City for more tourist projects and the likelihood of one or two sizeable office projects that will see this economy for what it is and cash in on its as a place to office people where there is a great quality of lifestyle.



#148 Austin55

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 01:32 PM

I haven't followed this thread version closely, but this 30 story building is not the 901 Commerce project?

 

Yes, there wasn't anything new announced at this besides the branding of the area. The "new" hotels mentioned are also all hotels that were already announced (The Kimpton, Sandman/Waggoner, and remodeled Fairfield were the ones mentioned I believe)



#149 george84

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 01:44 PM

I was thinking the same, the 30 story building is certainly 901 Commerce. They just approximated the number of floors while talking about it. This forum would certainly have some idea about some new 30 story building that hasn't been announced yet. 



#150 renamerusk

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 02:12 PM

I was thinking the same, the 30 story building is certainly 901 Commerce. They just approximated the number of floors while talking about it. This forum would certainly have some idea about some new 30 story building that hasn't been announced yet. 

 

There is sufficient detail information in the public about 901 Commerce at the time of this new break.   I think that if it were referencing 901 Commerce, at this time, FWI would know the number of floors as well as describing it as mixed use residential project.  So I'm speculating that this is not 901 Commerce.

 

We would not necessarily know about a 30-story building until it was announced and goes before the DDRB.  I believe that it is something in the early stage.  I also think that it is going to likely occupy a space near to the FWCT to benefit from direct access to DFW Airport and to Downtown Dallas.  Projects like 901 Commerce and future high rises  for the time being are more a result of nearby transit and may not come under the sphere of the a proximity to the convention center.  Of course, this is just my opinion.






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