1246 replies to this topic

[Thurman52]

The S-T said the Belknap section will re-open on Saturday

[Brian Luenser]

The S-T said the Belknap section will re-open on Saturday

I think that is one thing we can all agree on. That is great news! Cheers to a straight Belknap. (I won't even complain about it not going East and West but Southwest and Northeast...)

This morning's prep for Saturday's traffic.

[Brian Luenser]

And as long as this is such a hot topic... 2 pics from this Friday morning. (8/8/8)

I will say this. I give HUGE bonus points for being different. And I too think it is way premature to call this facility ugly. The more unusual and unique a property is the more unfair it is to judge it in the early construction phase. I am still excited about this place. (In a muted, somewhat guarded manner.)

And one more thing. We are so used to looking at slick marketing brochures we need to remember these are just some clown's construction spy shots. (Me being the clown)

[Fort Worthology]

Egads, it's getting worse. The Belknap frontage is seriously going to be a blank concrete slab wall?

[360texas]

To me this block of concrete is sitting in the bluff's leading edge. Bunker is definately TORNADO PROOF !!! And who would want to work in a windowless office. OH yes, That would be TCC Office staff. No view [read vision]. Maybe sort of like the building design?

[David Love]

Star Telegram, 20 Jul

And the college could face additional costs in contract penalties for halting some work midstream, college officials say.

The spiraling costs have left college trustees questioning whether they should spend an estimated $93 million more to finish the four buildings left from the original design for new offices on the downtown side of the river.

"There’s still a possibility of moving the offices," TCC board President Louise Appleman said recently.

Among the options expected to be discussed at upcoming board meetings are whether to complete construction of the buildings and sell them, either finished or unfinished, or to complete the project and move the college’s administration offices into the complex from its current location across the street from the Fort Worth Convention Center on the south end of downtown.

Selling the property is "one of the things we’ve talked about," Appleman said.

The trustees will also need to decide whether when they will sell the nearly 29 acres the college owns on the north side of the Trinity and whether to exercise an option on nearly 18 acres.

[David Love]

I believe they've accurately anticipated people’s reactions and built themselves a bunker.

I kind of reminds me of an Aztec pyramid, wonder what will be the first sacrifice will be.

[360texas]

And the college could face additional costs in contract penalties for halting some work midstream, college officials say.

I would think that a Penalty is an expense it is money assessed and collected for not doing something. Contract Termination expenses are not penalties. They are real expenses incurred by suppliers, subcontactors and contractors as a result of having to shut down contract work flow. Like the cost of returning a product and the vendor having to pay labor cost to put the product back on the storage shelf. Or cut out material wasted when a production line has to be stopped.

Yes Penalty (read job loss) should be assessed the TCC folks for wasting tax payer money.

[David Love]

The more I look at the structure, kind of grows on you, I’m hoping it might not be so bad once it’s completed and you’re up close.

Since we have no choice but to live with it I'm trying to find something redeeming about the structure, ...still looking.

[gdvanc]

Dustin, Jonny - come on. What we see so far is just ugly. Dogs won't even get close enough to hike a leg and mark their territory on it. Parking garages are making fun of it. What's there now puts the UGH! in Ugly.

I do hope it turns out much better than it is looking now. Maybe it will grow into a swan. We'll see.

Honestly, I think the facade of the Carnegie is more of a failure than this. Does it look like every other old (or wannabe-old) building in Fort Worth? No, and thank God it doesn't. How can a city be interesting with out some visual variety? Anyway, let's not be so quick to judge until we get closer to completion.

So you think the Carnegie looks like every other old (or wannabe-old) building in Fort Worth? I'll have to disagree. I don't think it looks like 714 Main. Or the Blackstone. Or the Commerce Building. Or the WT Waggoner or the Historic Electric Building. Or the Petroleum Building, the Sinclair, or the T&P Terminal. Or STS, HPL, or the Sanger. I'm certainly no expert in architecture, but I think the old buildings display at least as much stylistic and decorative variety as do their more modern peers.

I agree that there are similarities between the Carnegie and some older buildings in Fort Worth and beyond, but retro is common in all forms of art. I agree variety is important, but I think Fort Worth has that. If you take stock of the Fort's current inventory of buildings and those under construction, I don't see how you can have any reason to worry that any one historical style is going to dominate the urban landscape.

I think the Carnegie does look familiar at first sight. You get the impression you may have seen it before. But I get the same impression from the TCC Administration Bunker Complex: it reminds me of almost every sidewalk in Fort Worth. To me, the familiarity of the Carnegie is more comforting than the familiarity of the TCC.

[Sam Stone]

I think the TCC campus is pretty retro. They haven't designed blank concrete bunkers like that since the 70s.

[safly]

It looks like the movie set for that one movie back in the 80's that had a HUGE Mountain/Castle that these weird characters climbed in order to retrieve a unicorn or some crystal. And it was all black gray shale rock just crumbling and then this Cyclops character kinda helps em out and then the evil witch just puts them all back in their place, maybe it was a wizard. And this 5 bladed star looking weapon gets thrown about. Lots of struggle. Kinda like what I'm doing describing this THING.

[bhudson]

I think the TCC campus is pretty retro. They haven't designed blank concrete bunkers like that since the 70s.

Well played, sir!

[Brian Luenser]

All right guys. I am going to give you another chance to praise this building. I put on a different lens, got off of my %$&& and hit the pavement.

Here is your straight and pretty Belknap street as promised.



Up close from the West. The Southern exposure tilts back more than I thought.




I can't believe they are installing glass and did not send me a memo!

[Fort Worthology]

So, the pit (which will no longer be accessible from the street easily) gets glass, while the streetscape gets concrete slabs.

Whatever.

[David Love]

So, the pit (which will no longer be accessible from the street easily) gets glass, while the streetscape gets concrete slabs.

Whatever.

Wouldn't it seem they're more interested in the view from the inside of the structure, kind of does make sense from a public structure perspective safety wise anyway.

I'd imagine that pesky bridge was a serious visual impedance from the glass side of the building.

[mosteijn]

So, the pit (which will no longer be accessible from the street easily) gets glass, while the streetscape gets concrete slabs.

Whatever.

Case in point, the structure ends up not functioning correctly because important design elements were eliminated. Because a few short sighted individuals decided they looked "ghastly" and "atrocious" and whatever other "quaint" pejoratives you can think of. And because its also better to exact revenge on the people who screwed up this building rather than make sure it lives up to its potential. Talk about insulting the "public realm"...

I had a longer response lined up, but why bother. By liking this building I've obviously expressed my hatred for humanity, beauty and every other style of architecture known to exist, and you know what...it's kind of fun playing devil's advocate. Kevin, this evil modernist will still love your site and appreciate everything you're trying to do for this town, even if you do manage to constantly insult the profession he's decided to devote his life to.

[gdvanc]

Case in point, the structure ends up not functioning correctly because important design elements were eliminated. Because a few short sighted individuals decided they looked "ghastly" and "atrocious" and whatever other "quaint" pejoratives you can think of. And because its also better to exact revenge on the people who screwed up this building rather than make sure it lives up to its potential. Talk about insulting the "public realm"...

I wish you'd rolled with the longer response because I'm having trouble understanding your first paragraph.

Are you saying the important design elements were eliminated because a few short-sighted individuals expressed their distaste for the design? According to TCC, they changed direction and bought the RadioShack campus because it gave them (1) more space (2) in a better building (3) sooner and (4) with more cost certainty. Also, RadioShack was deemed by TCC to be a better building because many features were eliminated from the original TCC design in an effort to cut costs. No mention of public opinion.

Who's exactly is "exacting revenge" on anyone?

And by what possible means would that person or persons manage to make sure the building lives up to its potential?

Keeping in mind that there are several criticisms of the campus (cost [to taxpayers], damage to bluff, sunken plaza, design from an architectural style perspective, design from an urban planning perspective, ...), I think it's helpful to remember that the criticisms about the building's atrociously ghastly design were not much expressed until we actually got to see parts of its exterior in the past couple of days. Given that, it hardly seems appropriate to blame the failure of the original plan on those thoughtfully expressed opinions. That train had already sailed.

By liking this building I've obviously expressed my hatred for humanity, beauty and every other style of architecture known to exist, and you know what..

What the-?

[360texas]

No matter what the building exterior looks like, I am pleased that they are starting to get the building enclosed. Almost like clock work bad weather starts around easing into the region around 1st/2nd week in September. Given this almost mid August, remaining time is about 3 - 4 weeks before storms start entering the region.

As I recall, about 80% of the remaining work [mech/ elect and interior finishes) occurs in about the last 20% of the contract time frame after building gets closed in.

[Fort Worthology]

Case in point, the structure ends up not functioning correctly because important design elements were eliminated. Because a few short sighted individuals decided they looked "ghastly" and "atrocious" and whatever other "quaint" pejoratives you can think of. And because its also better to exact revenge on the people who screwed up this building rather than make sure it lives up to its potential. Talk about insulting the "public realm"...

Johnny, the elimination of the sunken plaza (another bad idea) doesn't change the fact that the building's got terrible street interaction on Belknap and Commerce. It would have been awful with or without the sunken access path. By the looks of it, the whole Belknap quasi-bridge thing turned out bad as well.

I am really surprised at you for the scare quotes around "public realm." I know you know what I'm talking about and know what makes a good and bad public space. Careful around arch students and profs. I prescribe 300ccs of Jane Jacobs, STAT.

I had a longer response lined up, but why bother. By liking this building I've obviously expressed my hatred for humanity, beauty and every other style of architecture known to exist, and you know what...it's kind of fun playing devil's advocate. Kevin, this evil modernist will still love your site and appreciate everything you're trying to do for this town, even if you do manage to constantly insult the profession he's decided to devote his life to.

I'm not insulting the profession - I'm expecting better of it than ahistorical inhuman concrete boxes. Is that so wrong? Could you explain how a mostly windowless slanted concrete box with terrible street interaction is "progress?"

Feh, I say. Robert Adam is right - modernism has hardened into this fundamentalist orthodoxy, completely intolerant of dissent and bordering on totalitarianism.

This fascistic attitude of "this is the one true way forward" that always comes about in these topics is what's really insulting, frankly. To say I insult the profession insinuates that the only true architecture and architects are the people making this junk, and that's just flat out wrong. This insinuation that only modernism is valid - horse****. Stern, Duany, Porphyrios, Terry, Adam, Robertson, Greenburg, Krier, and friends - superbly talented architects who haven't cast thousands of years of built environment to the trash.

[Dismuke]

I think the architect designed the building as a tribute and memorial to the great architectural masterpiece that was located across Belknap and so sadly destroyed in order to make way for the project.

One Commerce Place may no longer be with us - but its spirit is being reborn and lives on!

[Brian Luenser]

I think the architect designed the building as a tribute and memorial to the great architectural masterpiece that was located across Belknap and so sadly destroyed in order to make way for the project.

One Commerce Place may no longer be with us - but its spirit is being reborn and lives on!

[

Hey, I like that building a lot, too!

(looks like it is either a bomb shelter, a chemical warfare test center, the tomb of General William Jenkins Worth or a downtown Sundance Square air conditioning parts depot.)

[Dismuke]

Hey, I like that building a lot, too!

(looks like it is either a bomb shelter, a chemical warfare test center, the tomb of General William Jenkins Worth or a downtown Sundance Square air conditioning parts depot.)

Yes. And somebody needs to get the same architect who is building the college to put up a nearby high rise that adheres to a similar architectural aesthetic as the new college building and the much missed and mourned One Commerce Place. We need something that looks like this:





The high rise needs to be positioned so that it blocks out as much of a view of the old, and therefore bad, courthouse as much as possible. That courthouse is so old that it is an embarrassment to the city. It shouts out "cow town" when what we want is "Now Town!"

And if you don't like the building in the picture - well, that means you are either a non-progressive old fashioned fuddy duddy mired in the past or some backward rube who drinks the sort of coffee served in truck stops and gas stations. And if the Bass family is not forward-thinking enough and does not care enough about the city to build such a tower, then we need to have the TCC raise our property taxes so that they can build it themselves.

Until the new tower is built, I think we all ought to get ourselves into the spirit of the new campus architecture. Anyone know where we can purchase some leisure suits and mood rings?

[redhead]

Is that a REAL building or something you created in Photoshop??? Where/what is it??? (just briefly off topic, please humor me.)

[Dismuke]

Is that a REAL building or something you created in Photoshop??? Where/what is it??? (just briefly off topic, please humor me.)

Yes, it is an actual building.

As to what and where it is - well, let's make a little contest out of it. Perhaps starting a new thread for the contest would be appropriate.

The winner gets bragging rights - and I will even through in a CD of some cool 1920s and 1930s era 78 rpm audio restorations.

There are plenty of pictures of it on the 'net and they can be easily found if one googles the name of the name of the building.

I will give one hint and only one hint as to where it is: A very historic building was destroyed to make way for it - and the tale of that building's destruction is sad and tragic in its own right.

- - -

p.s. I have started a separate thread for the contest here.

[Brian Luenser]

I have been wanting to do this for a week. Go out on the new Belknap bridge when there was no traffic (ie, Sunday morning at 7:32) and take a few shots of the TCC complex from that perspective. It is my first real look at the complex and between the buildings. I sure can better appreciate how much money is in this place. There is a lot of work being done with a lot of materials. I did get chased out by a Security Guard as I went on the inside of the road barricades to get up to the metal handrails. (Didn't really feel like I was trespassing but a quick survey of the guard made my decision to get the %&$* out of there... and he didn't strike me as the type of guy that would be impressed with my, "Do you realize how much of my property taxes is paying for this complex?" argument)


3 super fresh pictures of this complex this morning. Let's take a look, shall we?

[360texas]

Sorry bit late in the day for my comment.

GREAT ! A bit of bravado always make for some great images up close and personal. I think I actually see some of MY property tax dollars hanging out of the concrete wall over there on the right side. There is my tax coinage there on the ground.. the red street cone mid center.

THANK YOU for the UP CLOSE and PERSONAL view of my tax dollars at work and PLAY !

Job well done !!!

[RD Milhollin]

...I think I actually see some of MY property tax dollars hanging out of the concrete wall over there on the right side. There is my tax coinage there on the ground.. the red street cone mid center...

In order to save some more tax money and find a productive use for the shell the College District has already constructed...

Why not build a wall to close in the open end of the couryard facing the river and put the new county jail facility here! It sort of looks like a jail from the outside.

HEY! The idea of using the Radio Shack Campus as the college was first voiced on this forum, what's so bad about MY IDEA?!

[safly]

Well, since the RS idear sensibly caught some momentum from this Forum. Let's keep on encouraging outside the box thinking, but from within.

How about a New Tarrant COUNTY "COINED" Athletic Center???

With Arena Football stadium included, have it built cantilevered halfway over the river. And soccer of course. County Olympic Natatorium, Indoor Rock climbing. Leisure pool on the rooftop. Adult Weight Gymnasium. Indoor Golf Simulators. Fencing! BOXING! Martial Arts!

Laser Tag, ANYTHING!

[AdamB]

Well.... A Fort Worth Athletic Club would be cool. Whatever it is it needs to be public use. I could envision some Olympic Size pools, indoor gym along with other facilities so that we could hold national events. Kind of like an Olympic facility.

[safly]

Oh, of course public use. County coined.

But I do agree that the facility needs to be WORLD CLASS.

[longhornz32]

I had some spare time this weekend so I went and saw some of the projects I have been reading so much about on this site. Here are 3 of TCC but they aren't much different from Monee's pics.

I know there has been much discussion on this project as far as using our tax dollars and design etc. I come from an architecture background and often wonder how often architects are designing for other architects. From what I see of this project so far I REALLY like it. I get what the architect is saying as far as how this building is probably going to be seen i.e. from a fast moving car about to cross the river, the need for privacy and preventing noise pollution, the fact that it must work with such a difficult site and it's connection across the river.

We can tell that it's not going to resemble the buildings built 100 years ago but does this site and this project ask for this kind of traditional resemblance? I couldn't imagine a building like The Carnegie being built at this same site. It just wouldn't work. I just think it wouldn't be appropriate.

[AndyN]

More waste and loss at TCC's hands. Tsk. Tsk. Could the junior college jusitify adding commercial production classes?

Switching Scenes: Or, Will Fort Worth's Loss Turn Into Dallas's Gain?

Wed Aug 27, 2008 at 04:54:26 PM

Came across this interesting item on the Interwebs today: CRM Studios is being forced to move out of its longtime home on the downtown Fort Worth RadioShack Corporation campus. Which is a very big deal, even if you've never heard of CRM. Because, see, years ago it was RadioShack's in-house ad agency -- among the largest of its kind anywhere in the world. "It was built to save RadioShack tons of money," says CRM's chief marketing officer, Tom Kirkhart, who confirms the anonymous posting. ("Reads like it was written by a competitor," he says, laughing.)

And the studio did make money for RadioShack, for a long, long time. Then, a few years ago, it moved across the complex, expanded into a 48,000-square-foot, state-of-the-art production facility and morphed into CRM, which, among many other things, provides all of the in-house programming for the likes of GameStop and generates some $8 million in revenue annually. But three years after the studio was showcased in Broadcast Engineering, CRM's being kicked out to make room for a Tarrant County College District medical lab. In June, the TCCD bought the RadioShack complex for $238 million -- in cash -- and, following an $80-million redo, intends to open it as a college campus come September 2009. So CRM gets the boot. But to where? Dallas, maybe?

Read the rest of the story by Clicking Here.

[Fort Worthology]

It begs the question - why, when there is obvious strong demand for office space in downtown Fort Worth (heck, the Carnegie's darn near fully leased three months before it's finished), and when there are not only businesses who might want to move here but businesses that are here and might have to leave, are we not seeing a lot more office construction going on?

It's just weird, is all.

[Keller Pirate]

Sounds like these studios can't be easily or cheaply replaced. So sad. This is reminiscent of the problem Capitol Records is going through in Hollywood, with new development near by.

[JKC]

We're working very hard as we speak to keep CRM in Downtown Fort Worth. We need them to stay here.

[AndyN]

C Burton summed up my thoughts with his comments on the Unfair Park Blog. Even if we keep CRM in Fort Worth, what kind of waste will we be seeing if the conversion happens?

That’s why I find TCC’s plan to “renovate” this facility into ordinary lab space so shocking. I can’t believe that anyone on the planning committee could look at this space and not say, “Well, look what we have here: A professional studio that we could use to offer our community a first-class education in digital media. We already offer an associate’s degree in TV & Radio Broadcasting. The only thing we’ll need to build is a curriculum that takes full advantage of this goldmine of opportunity. There’s no way we would ever squander this opportunity. This is truly a hidden gem that, frankly, we lucked into: A ready-made ‘classroom’ designed from the ground up as a state-of-the-art production center.”

[Stadtplan]

CIRCLE | R | MEDIA's commercial video production facility
From Broadcast Engineering Jan 1, 2006 12:00 PM, By Tim Davis


Track lighting sets the mood for those working in the video control rooms while the completely patchable monitor bridge can be easily viewed from anywhere in the room.


The 3800sq-ft sound stage comes complete with a DeSisti retractable lighting system equipped with 160 dimmers and HDC hoist digital control.


Studio A’s DeSisti lighting system contains movable, self-leveling battens and an HDC hoist digital control system.


The audio control room is isolated from the video control room, making for a more precise listening environment — the envy of any audiophile.


The facility’s engineers provide service to the three individual stages and two control rooms from one central area. Cameras, intercom stations, tallies and routers can all be easily switched from one to another in seconds.


The bamboo flooring in the audio suites and video-audio control rooms sits atop a dual floating concrete slab foundation. This, along with the sound absorbing material on the walls, makes for an ultra-quiet working environment.


The central machine room is the main hub from which all processes take place. Noise is kept to a minimum within the surrounding edit suites because routing, patching and tape playback occur in this area.

[Fort Worthology]

Yeah, getting rid of that would be unbelievably stupid - which is starting to sound more and more like TCC's modus operandi.

[Keller Pirate]

The TCC downtown campus is going to primarily offer classes in health sciences, so they say. The TV and Radio Broadcasting is taught somewhere else. It appears TCC is creating specialized campus curriculums.

I suspect that most of the audio, video and editing equipment will move with Circle R to their new location, it depends on who owns it, so this may not be as big an opportunity as it first seemed. The dual floating slab floors are the true unique component that will be lost.

[redhead]

I understand there was a TCC board meeting last night. Anyone know what happened? I am quite surprised that they have not yet pulled the plug on the continued construction...why couldn't that be sold for speculative office space?

[JBB]

Tarrant County College trustees pass budget
By MARK AGEE rmagee@star-telegram.com

FORT WORTH — Tarrant County College trustees approved the budget for the next fiscal year Wednesday night after a long and tense debate about how to spend money allocated for the controversial downtown campus.

When presented with a building fund request of about $52.2 million, trustees added an amendment that requires further board approval before administrators spend a $17.9 million portion that is allotted for the project on the banks of the Trinity River, spokeswoman Donna Darovich said. That money is intended to finish the outside of the buildings to protect them from rain and provide security until the board decides how to use the facility, Chancellor Leonardo de la Garza said.

The budget was approved 5-2. Board members Joe Hudson and Bobby McGee voted no.

Hudson said he didn’t fully understand where all the money was going. "I don’t think we’re there yet, and I don’t think we’ll get there if we stayed until 6 in the morning," he said.

The operating budget increases from $241 million to $252 million and includes a 5 percent pay raise for all employees. Tuition remains at $50 per credit hour.

[JBB]

The tower crane closest to the river is coming down today.

The S-T had an article yesterday indicating that a decision on what to do with the property on the bluff could happen at the TCC board meeting later this month.

[360texas]

Interesting observation.

Crane coming down means that it is no longer needed for work and can be shipped to its next work destination. Also means that once off site.. TCCC contractor does not have to pay for daily operations.

[Brian Luenser]

The tower crane closest to the river is coming down today.

The S-T had an article yesterday indicating that a decision on what to do with the property on the bluff could happen at the TCC board meeting later this month.

Roger that. Single big crane remains.

[Fort Worthology]

I see they're filling in the rest of the upper level facing the courthouse. Looks like the part they'd left off, which I was hoping would have been glass (or at least, not concrete slabs) is, in fact, more concrete slabs.

What a wonderful place to work that office will be. Humans don't like natural light anyway, right? I think this is the turning point that finally transforms me into some sort of anti-modern-architecture superhero, or something.

Crimeny, but this is terrible stuff.

[safly]

It seems very small for such a WHOPPING PRICETAG!

[Brian Luenser]

It seems very small for such a WHOPPING PRICETAG!

Don't they say the camera makes you lose 80,000 square feet?

[safly]

Good one.

[bhudson]

I think this is the turning point that finally transforms me into some sort of anti-modern-architecture superhero, or something.

I thought you already were there... You mean there are further levels of transform-itude?

I never had high hopes for this campus, but what I can see so far is worse than anything I could have envisioned.